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Science Fiction » alt.startrek » Berman and Trek XI
| Berman and Trek XI [message #47651] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 20:17 |
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http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
For anyone who cares.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47655 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 20:49 |
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"Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:0Hnme.50$Ag1.33 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
> For anyone who cares.
Thanks :-)
But, did I miss something?? "...although for at least one, he didn't
completely seem to have left the world of Trek behind him."
???? Do you mean that Berman /has/ left Trek behind??! Does this mean
SALVATION????
BREAK OUT THE PARTY FAVORS!!! WOO HOO!!!
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47658 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 21:20 |
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"Snake" <fluidstates_NO+SPAM [at] REMOVE-ME.verizon.IHATESPAM.SPAM_VAC.com> wrote
in message news:o9ome.4505$zb.2214 [at] trndny06...
> "Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:0Hnme.50$Ag1.33 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> > http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
> > For anyone who cares.
>
> Thanks :-)
>
> But, did I miss something?? "...although for at least one, he didn't
> completely seem to have left the world of Trek behind him."
>
> ???? Do you mean that Berman /has/ left Trek behind??! Does this mean
> SALVATION????
>
> BREAK OUT THE PARTY FAVORS!!! WOO HOO!!!
Theres probably not much for him to do right now except wait for the
screenplay to get finished.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47659 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 21:35 |
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"Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] y.ahoo.com> wrote in message
news:RBome.59$Ag1.55 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> Theres probably not much for him to do right now except wait for the
> screenplay to get finished.
:-)
Of course there are many things for a person like him to do while "he
waits":
There are at least 1000 subway trains a day in New York he could jump in
front of.
Climbing over the fencing around the Observation Deck of the Empire State
Building, then letting go, is excellent exercise for the lower muscle
groups.
Medical researchers are always looking for vivisection volunteers.
The world diving record - 10,000 feet without a suit or submarine - still
has yet to be achieved.
Stopping a tractor-trailer from 80 MPH - using a full-body frontal assault -
would make a great television special (he can even self-produce it)
Volunteer as a "smart bomb" (with him, truly an oxymoron) on the front lines
of Iraq.
As a live, moving object he would make great target practice for the Army's
National Guard tank division.
And, finally, using the 1,000,000 other methods available it is never too
late to show yourself worthy of this year's Darwin Award.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47663 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 23:17 |
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On Sun, 29 May 2005 18:17:32 GMT, "Eric Nichols"
<sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
>http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
>For anyone who cares.
>
Berman is out of a job pretty soon. He and Braga will be gone from
Paramount by August probably.
And it's for darn sure that he has no say whatsoever anymore about
Trek.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47666 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 23:23 |
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"Snake" <fluidstates_NO+SPAM [at] REMOVE-ME.verizon.IHATESPAM.SPAM_VAC.com> wrote
in message news:_Pome.1130$Sl5.828 [at] trndny08...
> "Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] y.ahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:RBome.59$Ag1.55 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> > Theres probably not much for him to do right now except wait for the
> > screenplay to get finished.
>
> :-)
>
> Of course there are many things for a person like him to do while "he
> waits":
>
> There are at least 1000 subway trains a day in New York he could jump in
> front of.
>
> Climbing over the fencing around the Observation Deck of the Empire State
> Building, then letting go, is excellent exercise for the lower muscle
> groups.
>
> Medical researchers are always looking for vivisection volunteers.
>
> The world diving record - 10,000 feet without a suit or submarine - still
> has yet to be achieved.
>
> Stopping a tractor-trailer from 80 MPH - using a full-body frontal
assault -
> would make a great television special (he can even self-produce it)
>
> Volunteer as a "smart bomb" (with him, truly an oxymoron) on the front
lines
> of Iraq.
>
> As a live, moving object he would make great target practice for the
Army's
> National Guard tank division.
>
> And, finally, using the 1,000,000 other methods available it is never too
> late to show yourself worthy of this year's Darwin Award.
Are you suggesting an 'accident'?
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47667 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 23:27 |
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In article <0Hnme.50$Ag1.33 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>,
sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com says...
> http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
> For anyone who cares.
"Berman once more addressed the reasons for Star Trek: Enterprise's
cancellation, mentioning once again the over-saturation of the franchise,
but also the hefty pricetag associated with a show like Star Trek."
Sheesh! Will this S.O.B. never stop trying to cover his butt? Hey Rick,
the only part of the franchise that's over-saturated is your boundless
ego.
"'Unfortunately, our show costs a lot more than [the Sci-Fi Channel's]
shows do,' he said. 'A lot of those shows are shot with budgets not much
more than half of what out budgets are. I think that to continue our show
at the level of production we've kept it at, to keep these actors, it
would probably be prohibitive to do it on cable.' "
Y'know, I'd rather see a show with cheesy special effects but with decent
writing and acting.
Of course if they *really* wanted to free up money for production
purposes they could fire Berman -- a genuine twofer, yielding a
significant savings *and* getting rid of the clueless bastard at the same
time.
ww
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47671 ] |
So, 29 Mai 2005 23:42 |
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Stan Jensen wrote:
> Berman is out of a job pretty soon. He and Braga will be gone from
> Paramount by August probably.
How do you know that?
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47672 ] |
Mo, 30 Mai 2005 00:25 |
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"Wandering Wastrel" <me [at] oddswithmyself.edu> wrote in message
news:MPG.1d03fdcd40ab3b8c989697 [at] news.pa.comcast.giganews.com...
> In article <0Hnme.50$Ag1.33 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com>,
> sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com says...
>> http://www.trektoday.com/news/280505_01.shtml
>> For anyone who cares.
>
> "Berman once more addressed the reasons for Star Trek: Enterprise's
> cancellation, mentioning once again the over-saturation of the franchise,
> but also the hefty pricetag associated with a show like Star Trek."
>
> Sheesh! Will this S.O.B. never stop trying to cover his butt? Hey Rick,
> the only part of the franchise that's over-saturated is your boundless
> ego.
Exactly!! In almost every media outlet I've seen they speak of Star Trek's
"demise" and the cancellation of Enterprise. They repeat Berman's words of
"oversaturation" and "fan burnout", et al.
A few mentioned internet fan's desire to oust Berman with the (implied)
question, "Why?" Here is a man, at the head of an organization -
Paramount's production of Star Trek - with /at least/ 3 solid, HUGE failures
behind him.
Yet...he stays in control.
If a *corporate* manager or CEO has such histories of failures - money
losers for the stockholders - he would have been replaced.
WHY is it wrong for /us/ to request the same?? WHY are WE made out to be
evil and hate-mongerers, "against Berman personally", when his professional
performance has been an utter failure? We have nothing against him
"Personally" - I don't know him personally, he may be a truly very nice man.
Move him sideways, into another Paramount area, so he and his family do not
lose their livelihood. I do not wish to attack him personally. But, as the
/business/ leader of Star Trek's direction, he is a failure and we *must*
replace him.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47691 ] |
Mo, 30 Mai 2005 02:34 |
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On Sun, 29 May 2005 22:25:30 GMT, "Snake"
<fluidstates_NO+SPAM [at] REMOVE-ME.verizon.IHATESPAM.SPAM_VAC.com> wrote:
>A few mentioned internet fan's desire to oust Berman with the (implied)
>question, "Why?" Here is a man, at the head of an organization -
>Paramount's production of Star Trek - with /at least/ 3 solid, HUGE failures
>behind him.
>
>Yet...he stays in control.
He also has 25 years of *successful* TV programming behind him. There are
few producers in any genre at any time that can match that. 'Bout the only
modern one is Dick Wolfe. Berman is an unqualified success as a producer by
any standard I understand .. The online Trek fanbase hates him so much that
that fanbase has collectively lost touch with reality. What Berman and Trek
have meant to Paramount's bottom line over the years is beyond dispute.
And, it is all good, numbers for Nemesis and Enterprise excepted.
Myself, I think he is burnt out on Trek, and the franchise needs another
producer with a different vision. However, until I'm shown otherwise by
ratings and bottom lines, I remain convinced that a new vision at the top
will make no difference in the arena that means most to Paramount. Because
we're burnt out, too. Trek needs a rest. We need a rest.
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #47695 ] |
Mo, 30 Mai 2005 03:16 |
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In article <2enk919nf8o8j85qsfgblip8opvkpdr8uj [at] 4ax.com>, pttyg47-
1230 [at] copper.net says...
> On Sun, 29 May 2005 22:25:30 GMT, "Snake"
> <fluidstates_NO+SPAM [at] REMOVE-ME.verizon.IHATESPAM.SPAM_VAC.com> wrote:
>
> >A few mentioned internet fan's desire to oust Berman with the (implied)
> >question, "Why?" Here is a man, at the head of an organization -
> >Paramount's production of Star Trek - with /at least/ 3 solid, HUGE failures
> >behind him.
> >
> >Yet...he stays in control.
>
> He also has 25 years of *successful* TV programming behind him. There are
> few producers in any genre at any time that can match that. 'Bout the only
> modern one is Dick Wolfe. Berman is an unqualified success as a producer by
> any standard I understand .. The online Trek fanbase hates him so much that
> that fanbase has collectively lost touch with reality. What Berman and Trek
> have meant to Paramount's bottom line over the years is beyond dispute.
> And, it is all good, numbers for Nemesis and Enterprise excepted.
>
> Myself, I think he is burnt out on Trek, and the franchise needs another
> producer with a different vision. However, until I'm shown otherwise by
> ratings and bottom lines, I remain convinced that a new vision at the top
> will make no difference in the arena that means most to Paramount. Because
> we're burnt out, too. Trek needs a rest. We need a rest.
*He* (Berman) is clearly burnt out on Trek -- and I'm burnt out on
Berman. But that doesn't mean someone with vision and talent couldn't
produce a fresh and high-quality series.
The initial idea of ENT going back to pre-Federation days held lots of
promise, but it was wasted with tricks and gimmicks like the abominable
Temporal Cold War, Future Guy, the Xindi, etc. It was clear that Berman,
instead of seeing it as an opportunity to explore the facets of
humanity's first days interacting with alien cultures, settling colonies,
coming to terms with the effects this would have on human beings and
human society saw it as a kind of continuation of the whiz-bang, temporal
hi jinks which became overused in latter-day Trek.
Instead of quality writing, concepts and stories, we had writers trying
to come up with scenarios which seemed woefully out of step with the
times in which they were to take place and a kind of contempt for canon
which made me feel that Berman had reached a point where he was just sick
and tired of Trek -- that he was perhaps subconsciously sabotaging the
franchise to give himself a way out.
The superior work Manny Coto did in the last season proved that Trek
still has lots of potential. But ENT was riddled with problems, not the
least of which were inconsistent characters, lazy concept development,
and stories which did little to expound on the potential themes available
in the prequel setting. It was so bad that even Coto had to write a hasty
fix at the beginning of the season that just demonstrated how terrible
the overall production vision of the series had been up to that point.
Berman needs a long rest -- and we need a (permanent) rest from Berman.
Trek needs new blood and with it I think we would see a kind of rebirth.
But I feel that Berman will keep repeating the same idiotic mantra and
TPTB and many fans will accept it because of his past rep -- despite the
fact that his recent output, not to mention his judgment, is fatally
flawed. As a result he'll sit on the franchise, nothing will happen for a
year or two and then he'll be back, putting out the same kind of tripe
he's been spewing forth of late. Then Trek will *really* be in trouble --
let's hope it doesn't come to that.
ww
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #50911 ] |
Di, 31 Mai 2005 15:55 |
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"Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:upqme.69$JQ6.23 [at] newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
> "Snake" <fluidstates_NO+SPAM [at] REMOVE-ME.verizon.IHATESPAM.SPAM_VAC.com>
wrote
> in message news:_Pome.1130$Sl5.828 [at] trndny08...
> > "Eric Nichols" <sugarbearnichols [at] y.ahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:RBome.59$Ag1.55 [at] newssvr12.news.prodigy.com...
> > > Theres probably not much for him to do right now except wait for the
> > > screenplay to get finished.
> >
> > :-)
> >
> > Of course there are many things for a person like him to do while "he
> > waits":
> >
> > There are at least 1000 subway trains a day in New York he could jump in
> > front of.
> >
> > Climbing over the fencing around the Observation Deck of the Empire
State
> > Building, then letting go, is excellent exercise for the lower muscle
> > groups.
> >
> > Medical researchers are always looking for vivisection volunteers.
> >
> > The world diving record - 10,000 feet without a suit or submarine -
still
> > has yet to be achieved.
> >
> > Stopping a tractor-trailer from 80 MPH - using a full-body frontal
> assault -
> > would make a great television special (he can even self-produce it)
> >
> > Volunteer as a "smart bomb" (with him, truly an oxymoron) on the front
> lines
> > of Iraq.
> >
> > As a live, moving object he would make great target practice for the
> Army's
> > National Guard tank division.
> >
> > And, finally, using the 1,000,000 other methods available it is never
too
> > late to show yourself worthy of this year's Darwin Award.
>
> Are you suggesting an 'accident'?
Umm...just a "little" one?? :P
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| Re: Berman and Trek XI [message #50924 ] |
Di, 31 Mai 2005 20:40 |
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Hi!
If Berman is really so tired of Star Trek, why is he still on the
franchise and is now writing Trek XI???
I'm not burnt out of Trek, I only need a break from such series as
Voyager or Enterprise. The best of both has been the credit, because it
showed everything, the series itself lacked of: visionary space
exploration of strange, new worlds.
The setting of Enterprise sounded promising at first. But the very first
moment, they introduced this unbelievable temporal cold war, I knew, that
things will just get worse. And so it did.
Berman also doesn't know how to create interesting characters. Without the
Dominion war, Sisko behaved like a weepy meacock. The Voyager and
Enterprise crews reminded me of members of a group therapy. Everyone was
talking clearly about problems with the others, and magically there was
no real conflict at all. Everything has been worked out without any
difficulties. How interesting to watch!
In my opinion, Berman doesn't know much about producing and screenwriting.
With Trek XI he's just giving Trek the death blow. Fans should really
unite and try to prevent him from succeeding.
In this spirit
Yours Gernot
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