www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper

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Miscellaneous / Verschiedenes » alt.fan.james-bond » www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper

www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298273]

Fr, 07 Juli 2006 22:29

phil.gerrard1

http://www.mi6.co.uk/sections/articles/bond_21_girl_casting_ rumours.php3?t=&s=

Of the four mentioned, I think they got the right girl. Halle Berry
came damn close to stealing DAD, and not in a good way, while it could
be argued that Diana Rigg overshadowed Lazenby in OHMSS. Having an
actress considerably better-known than Craig playing Vesper would have
been a risky move IMHO. As for Cecile de France, well, Green's English
(and indeed her English accent) are certainly up to par.

Before the tabloid press pat themselves on the back for their efforts,
or anybody starts to think there *might* be something in their stories
after all, it should be noted that in the very same stories where they
named Jolie and Theron, these papers named many candidates who it now
appears were never in the running at all. In fact, just about every
'name' actress on the face of the planet was mentioned at one time or
another, so it would be more surprising if Jolie and Theron *hadn't*
been mentioned. It's kind of analogous to putting on a blindfold,
firing fifty rounds in the direction of a target, and then claiming to
be a crack shot if one of them happens to find the bull.

Best

Phil

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298317 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 07:57

phil.gerrard [at] ntlworld.com wrote:
> http://www.mi6.co.uk/sections/articles/bond_21_girl_casting_ rumours.php3?t=&s=
>
> Of the four mentioned, I think they got the right girl. Halle Berry
> came damn close to stealing DAD, and not in a good way, while it could
> be argued that Diana Rigg overshadowed Lazenby in OHMSS. Having an
> actress considerably better-known than Craig playing Vesper would have
> been a risky move IMHO. As for Cecile de France, well, Green's English
> (and indeed her English accent) are certainly up to par.
>
> Before the tabloid press pat themselves on the back for their efforts,
> or anybody starts to think there *might* be something in their stories
> after all, it should be noted that in the very same stories where they
> named Jolie and Theron, these papers named many candidates who it now
> appears were never in the running at all. In fact, just about every
> 'name' actress on the face of the planet was mentioned at one time or
> another, so it would be more surprising if Jolie and Theron *hadn't*
> been mentioned. It's kind of analogous to putting on a blindfold,
> firing fifty rounds in the direction of a target, and then claiming to
> be a crack shot if one of them happens to find the bull.
>

--- Wasn't Rachael Sterling also being considered and one or two
others? I don't think Jolie nor Theron would've been right for the
part. I wouldn't've minded Jolie, but she so obviously would've
overshadowed Craig, as she quite did in Tomb Raider since I don't even
remember him in that film. As for Theron, I believe she's almost 6
feet tall herself, which would've dwarfed Craig and that wouldn't do at
all. I know nothing of Cecile de France and a Google image search of
her shows her looking better with longer hair than short length. On
looks alone and with longer hair, she probably could've fit into Vesper
well enough if, as they claim, her English had been better. I still
have my reservations with Eva Green. There's a kind of sleepy, lazy,
dopey look about her that I don't get from Fleming's description of
Vesper, although I happened on a recent TV interview in which she spoke
with a Brit accent quite convincingly, so that's a plus right there
because as I said in my script review, Vesper needs to be English just
by the tone of the dialogue given her. However, I would've thought
there would've been a much wider field of actresses from which to
choose the absolutely right one. But we'll see how she struts her
stuff in the movie.

> Best
>
> Phil

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298319 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 11:16

Mac

WQ wrote:

--- Wasn't Rachael Sterling also being considered and one or two
> others? I don't think Jolie nor Theron would've been right for the
> part. I wouldn't've minded Jolie, but she so obviously would've
> overshadowed Craig, as she quite did in Tomb Raider since I don't even
> remember him in that film.

Because of their relative roles? One was the star, the other a
supporting actor. Next

> As for Theron, I believe she's almost 6
> feet tall herself, which would've dwarfed Craig and that wouldn't do
> at all.

Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
pursued her. Next.
--
-- Mac (672)

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298325 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 15:36

Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> --- Wasn't Rachael Sterling also being considered and one or two
> > others? I don't think Jolie nor Theron would've been right for the
> > part. I wouldn't've minded Jolie, but she so obviously would've
> > overshadowed Craig, as she quite did in Tomb Raider since I don't even
> > remember him in that film.
>
> Because of their relative roles? One was the star, the other a
> supporting actor. Next

--- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a lead
actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any real good
and has any real screen presence.

> > As for Theron, I believe she's almost 6
> > feet tall herself, which would've dwarfed Craig and that wouldn't do
> > at all.
>
> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> pursued her. Next.

--- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to Craig.
It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually see it.

> --
> -- Mac (672)
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298327 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 16:09

Mac

WQ wrote:

> --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a lead
> actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any real
> good and has any real screen presence.

Or has a role large enough. Next.

>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
>> pursued her. Next.
>
> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to Craig.
> It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually see it.

Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
--
-- Mac

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298329 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 17:04

Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> > --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a lead
> > actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any real
> > good and has any real screen presence.
>
> Or has a role large enough. Next.

--- A good enough actor can steal a movie with a small role.

> >> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> >> pursued her. Next.
> >
> > --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to Craig.
> > It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually see it.
>
> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.

--- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the one
who'd always get the part. Doesn't happen that way. It's all trial
and error for whatever reason. And then again, the on epicked could
still be the wrong one for the part.

> --
> -- Mac
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298330 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 17:24

Mac

WQ wrote:
> Mac wrote:
>> WQ wrote:
>>
>>> --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a
>>> lead actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any
>>> real good and has any real screen presence.
>>
>> Or has a role large enough. Next.
>
> --- A good enough actor can steal a movie with a small role.

Did Sean Connery steal THE LONGEST DAY? Next.

>
>>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
>>>> pursued her. Next.
>>>
>>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
>>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
>>> see it.
>>
>> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
>
> --- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the one
> who'd always get the part. Doesn't happen that way. It's all trial
> and error for whatever reason. And then again, the on epicked could
> still be the wrong one for the part.

They don't pick. They suggest. Next.
--
-- Mac

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298331 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 18:42

Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
> > Mac wrote:
> >> WQ wrote:
> >>
> >>> --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a
> >>> lead actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any
> >>> real good and has any real screen presence.
> >>
> >> Or has a role large enough. Next.
> >
> > --- A good enough actor can steal a movie with a small role.
>
> Did Sean Connery steal THE LONGEST DAY? Next.

--- Don't know. Never saw the film.

> >>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> >>>> pursued her. Next.
> >>>
> >>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
> >>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
> >>> see it.
> >>
> >> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
> >
> > --- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the one
> > who'd always get the part. Doesn't happen that way. It's all trial
> > and error for whatever reason. And then again, the on epicked could
> > still be the wrong one for the part.
>
> They don't pick. They suggest. Next.

--- Pick, suggest. Same thing. Someone gets called out of that.

> --
> -- Mac
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298332 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 18:54

Mac

WQ wrote:
> Mac wrote:
>> WQ wrote:
>>> Mac wrote:
>>>> WQ wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a
>>>>> lead actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any
>>>>> real good and has any real screen presence.
>>>>
>>>> Or has a role large enough. Next.
>>>
>>> --- A good enough actor can steal a movie with a small role.
>>
>> Did Sean Connery steal THE LONGEST DAY? Next.
>
> --- Don't know. Never saw the film.

Cop out.

>
>>>>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
>>>>>> pursued her. Next.
>>>>>
>>>>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
>>>>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
>>>>> see it.
>>>>
>>>> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
>>>
>>> --- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the
>>> one who'd always get the part. Doesn't happen that way. It's all
>>> trial and error for whatever reason. And then again, the on
>>> epicked could still be the wrong one for the part.
>>
>> They don't pick. They suggest. Next.
>
> --- Pick, suggest. Same thing. Someone gets called out of that.

Pick and suggest are not the same thing in casting. Casting do the
suggesting, producers and directors do the picking.
--
-- Mac

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298333 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:05

Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
> > Mac wrote:
> >> WQ wrote:
> >>> Mac wrote:
> >>>> WQ wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> --- What, it's not possible for a supporting actor to outshine a
> >>>>> lead actor, or at least balance the other out? Only if one is any
> >>>>> real good and has any real screen presence.
> >>>>
> >>>> Or has a role large enough. Next.
> >>>
> >>> --- A good enough actor can steal a movie with a small role.
> >>
> >> Did Sean Connery steal THE LONGEST DAY? Next.
> >
> > --- Don't know. Never saw the film.
>
> Cop out.

--- Send me a copy postpaid, then.

> >>>>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> >>>>>> pursued her. Next.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
> >>>>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
> >>>>> see it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
> >>>
> >>> --- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the
> >>> one who'd always get the part. Doesn't happen that way. It's all
> >>> trial and error for whatever reason. And then again, the on
> >>> epicked could still be the wrong one for the part.
> >>
> >> They don't pick. They suggest. Next.
> >
> > --- Pick, suggest. Same thing. Someone gets called out of that.
>
> Pick and suggest are not the same thing in casting. Casting do the
> suggesting, producers and directors do the picking.

--- Before you can suggest, you need to pick who to suggest. Pick,
suggest - same thing.

> --
> -- Mac
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298334 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:14

brentweaver

*snip*

> > >>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> > >>>> pursued her. Next.
> > >>>
> > >>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
> > >>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
> > >>> see it.
> > >>
> > >> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
> > >

Forgive me for interjecting, but as I used to work as an actor I
thought I'd clear something up. There are two points here. First of
all, the casting director(s) would have been well aware of the
individual actor's heights when casting this film - as in all films.
For a situation to occur where the casting directors, director, and
producers only realize the height difference when seeing the two people
together (I don't for a second buy the "to actually see it is
different" excuse) is at best absurd. These are professionals working
on a multi-million dollar (pound?) film.

Secondly, and even more importantly, it *doesn't matter* if Theron was
taller than Craig. Film-making is all about illusion. Many times
shots are framed to make someone look taller, or even shorter, than
they really are. I can't tell you how many films and TV shoots I've
been on where someone is standing on what's called an "apple box".
These are small black wooden boxes in a variety of sizes that, by
standing on it in a static shot, increases the actor's height by one to
several inches (at 5' 9" I've had to stand on them myself). For
walking shots I've seen, although rarely, someone walk on the street
and another person walk on the sidewalk to give a 2 or 3 inch height
difference in a wider shot, or walking on a lengthy platform on flat
ground. I've even seen forced perspective used!

It comes down to the fact that the film-makers want to make the best
product possible (okay, maybe everyone but the studio - they want
profitable) and therefore would rather cast actors based on ability and
chemistry rather than height. I should say luckily for me, as I was
cast opposite taller women a couple of times.

Dude!

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298335 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:17

Mac

WQ wrote:

>> Pick and suggest are not the same thing in casting. Casting do the
>> suggesting, producers and directors do the picking.
>
> --- Before you can suggest, you need to pick who to suggest. Pick,
> suggest - same thing.

Suggest: propose for selection or rejection

The casting people offer a *selection* of actors.

Pick: Make a choice/decision

The Producers/director pick the *actor* they wish to cast.

It's not difficult to understand. Unless one is just being argumentative for
the sake of it, which I rather think you are.
--
-- Mac

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298336 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:19

Mac

Dude! wrote:

> Forgive me for interjecting, but as I used to work as an actor I
> thought I'd clear something up. There are two points here. First of
> all, the casting director(s) would have been well aware of the
> individual actor's heights when casting this film - as in all films.
> For a situation to occur where the casting directors, director, and
> producers only realize the height difference when seeing the two
> people together (I don't for a second buy the "to actually see it is
> different" excuse) is at best absurd. These are professionals working
> on a multi-million dollar (pound?) film.

Thank you!

Now define "suggest" and "pick" in the casting process, will ya?
--
-- Mac

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298337 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:38

brentweaver

*snip*
>
> Thank you!
>
> Now define "suggest" and "pick" in the casting process, will ya?
> --
> -- Mac

Well, from my own experience it goes as follows:

Talent agents (agents representing the actors) are advised that a
project will be casting and are sent lists of what the casting agents
are looking for. There's a chararcter breakdown and it would say
something to the effect of "Mid 30's to mid 40's, average height (5' 8"
to 5' 10") and thin (140 to 170 lbs), could pass as a banker and has a
voice and demeanour that suggests someone with an education (no trace
of "street" about him)" This is very rough - I've been sent on
auditions where the only description for the character is "looking for
a young Harrison Ford type". Sometimes they don't care what the person
looks like, it's all based on performance.

The talent agents then send headshots and resumes for the actors they
suggest to the casting agent. The casting agents then pick who they
want to put on camera for an audition. At this point the decision is
entirely in their hands.

Next, on camera auditions are made and the casting agents either decide
who they want to come to callbacks (second round of auditions) or
confer with the producers and directors as to who they should have come
back. Sometimes the decision is made right away and by the casting
directors (for very small parts) but in my experience the director and
producers are always the ones who decide on the leads.

Again, this is very rough. For a film the budget and prestige of a
Bond film it's obviously going to be different. The producers may even
bypass most of the audition process and simply have an actor whose body
of work they're already familiar with come in for an on-camera reading.
In fact, I'd be astonished if they relied on the casting director to
make suggestions for who would play Bond. However, for a role like
Vesper (especially if they are casting actors who are more "unknown" to
the general public) the director and producers would rely on the
casting director to make suggestions (i.e actors who audition) but
again, the director and producers are the ones who pick (in other
words, cast) the actors.

Hope this helps,
Dude!

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298339 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:47

Tom Zielinski

"Mac" <see.mac [at] SPAMLESSvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:4ha7pcF1q5tpsU1 [at] individual.net...
> Dude! wrote:
>
>> Forgive me for interjecting, but as I used to work as an actor I
>> thought I'd clear something up. There are two points here. First of
>> all, the casting director(s) would have been well aware of the
>> individual actor's heights when casting this film - as in all films.
>> For a situation to occur where the casting directors, director, and
>> producers only realize the height difference when seeing the two
>> people together (I don't for a second buy the "to actually see it is
>> different" excuse) is at best absurd. These are professionals working
>> on a multi-million dollar (pound?) film.
>
> Thank you!
>
> Now define "suggest" and "pick" in the casting process, will ya?

Well...one can pick his friends...

Tom Zielinski

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298340 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 19:54

Dude! wrote:
> *snip*
>
> > > >>>> Casting people, and EON, didn't seem concerned as they reportedly
> > > >>>> pursued her. Next.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> --- And until they actually saw how tall she really was next to
> > > >>> Craig. It's one thing to know about it, it's another to actually
> > > >>> see it.
> > > >>
> > > >> Right. Casting people are so dumb. Next.
> > > >
>
> Forgive me for interjecting, but as I used to work as an actor I
> thought I'd clear something up. There are two points here. First of
> all, the casting director(s) would have been well aware of the
> individual actor's heights when casting this film - as in all films.
> For a situation to occur where the casting directors, director, and
> producers only realize the height difference when seeing the two people
> together (I don't for a second buy the "to actually see it is
> different" excuse) is at best absurd. These are professionals working
> on a multi-million dollar (pound?) film.
>
> Secondly, and even more importantly, it *doesn't matter* if Theron was
> taller than Craig. Film-making is all about illusion. Many times
> shots are framed to make someone look taller, or even shorter, than
> they really are. I can't tell you how many films and TV shoots I've
> been on where someone is standing on what's called an "apple box".
> These are small black wooden boxes in a variety of sizes that, by
> standing on it in a static shot, increases the actor's height by one to
> several inches (at 5' 9" I've had to stand on them myself). For
> walking shots I've seen, although rarely, someone walk on the street
> and another person walk on the sidewalk to give a 2 or 3 inch height
> difference in a wider shot, or walking on a lengthy platform on flat
> ground. I've even seen forced perspective used!
>
> It comes down to the fact that the film-makers want to make the best
> product possible (okay, maybe everyone but the studio - they want
> profitable) and therefore would rather cast actors based on ability and
> chemistry rather than height. I should say luckily for me, as I was
> cast opposite taller women a couple of times.

--- This is all very true. But where the problem could lie between
someone like Theron against Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what
went on with the consideration process involving Theron, but I would
bet that if there was a film test of the two together, her bone
structure may've worked against his, making her look broader than she
should be next to him, because he himself doesn't really have that
broad a bone structure, at least he doesn't scan that way on film.
Height may not be an issue, but bone structure may. Then again, it may
not be so for certain other roles, but for Bond, that may be an
important consideration for a particular Bond girl role, one that can't
be really seen till it's tested on film. That's my guess.

>
> Dude!

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298341 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 20:00

Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> >> Pick and suggest are not the same thing in casting. Casting do the
> >> suggesting, producers and directors do the picking.
> >
> > --- Before you can suggest, you need to pick who to suggest. Pick,
> > suggest - same thing.
>
> Suggest: propose for selection or rejection
>
> The casting people offer a *selection* of actors.
>
> Pick: Make a choice/decision
>
> The Producers/director pick the *actor* they wish to cast.
>
> It's not difficult to understand. Unless one is just being argumentative for
> the sake of it, which I rather think you are.

--- But the casting people still have to "pick" [make
choices/decisions] which actors to "suggest" [propose for selection or
rejection] to the producers. And yes, the producers can then make
their own "pick". Producers don't have a monopoly on the word "pick".
I know the individual meanings of the words, I'm just playing semantics
with you. You can call it quits whenever you like.

> --
> -- Mac
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298342 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 20:31

Nick Xylas

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298343 ]

Sa, 08 Juli 2006 20:39

Mac

WQ wrote:

> --- But the casting people still have to "pick" [make
> choices/decisions] which actors to "suggest" [propose for selection or
> rejection] to the producers. And yes, the producers can then make
> their own "pick". Producers don't have a monopoly on the word "pick".
> I know the individual meanings of the words, I'm just playing
> semantics with you. You can call it quits whenever you like.

I might, when I finally recover from laughing. You'll be posting about
face-width next....
--
-- Mac

"But where the problem could lie between someone like Theron against
Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what went on with the
consideration process involving Theron, but I would bet that if there
was a film test of the two together, her bone structure may've
worked against his, making her look broader than she should be next
to him,"-- Self-proclamed No.6 talking total No.2s 8/7/06

"Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06

"Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06

"It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06

"I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298344 ]

So, 09 Juli 2006 00:13

Will Traynor

"Mac" <see.mac [at] SPAMLESSvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:4hach0F1qf6mkU1 [at] individual.net...
> WQ wrote:
>
>> --- But the casting people still have to "pick" [make
>> choices/decisions] which actors to "suggest" [propose for selection or
>> rejection] to the producers. And yes, the producers can then make
>> their own "pick". Producers don't have a monopoly on the word "pick".
>> I know the individual meanings of the words, I'm just playing
>> semantics with you. You can call it quits whenever you like.
>
> I might, when I finally recover from laughing. You'll be posting about
> face-width next....
> --
> -- Mac
>
> "But where the problem could lie between someone like Theron against
> Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what went on with the
> consideration process involving Theron, but I would bet that if there
> was a film test of the two together, her bone structure may've
> worked against his, making her look broader than she should be next
> to him,"-- Self-proclamed No.6 talking total No.2s 8/7/06
>
> "Pascal was looking at Craig only from her own disturbed
> genital perspective and not in saner universal terms." -- WQ, 19/1/06
>
> "Barb's hots for him isn't too far off from the truth. You did see
> that shot of those nippies of hers practically popping through her
> T-shirt while standing next to him, didn't you?" -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
> "It's called Barbara Broccoli's suspicious friendship with Daniel
> Craig and her insistence on him for the role against everyone's wishes,
> including Michael Wilson's, who finally had to give in and maybe even
> got bribed into doing so." -- WQ, 3/1/06
>
> "I think it's more like: "You don't agree with me? Okay, then tell
> me otherwise and convince me." Anybody can hold opposite views to
> mine, just make sure you can back up your views, otherwise I'll just
> run you down to the ground till you do." -- WQ, 6/7/06
>
>
>

I admire your patience, Mac ;-)

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298352 ]

So, 09 Juli 2006 02:59

phil.gerrard1

WQ, Mac:

> > --- If they're that smart, then the first one they'd choose is the one
> > who'd always get the part.
>
> They don't pick. They suggest. Next.

I'd have said they *sift*...

....and that's probably earned me two plonks rather than two points.

Best

Phil

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298372 ]

So, 09 Juli 2006 14:55

Rich Handley

"WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>--- This is all very true. But where the problem could lie between
>someone like Theron against Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what
>went on with the consideration process involving Theron, but I would
>bet that if there was a film test of the two together, her bone
>structure may've worked against his, making her look broader than she
>should be next to him, because he himself doesn't really have that
>broad a bone structure, at least he doesn't scan that way on film.
>Height may not be an issue, but bone structure may. Then again, it may
>not be so for certain other roles, but for Bond, that may be an
>important consideration for a particular Bond girl role, one that can't
>be really seen till it's tested on film. That's my guess.

You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. Did you even read
what "Dude" wrote?

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298374 ]

So, 09 Juli 2006 15:20

Tom Zielinski

"Rich Handley" <rhandley [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
news:c4v1b2pai9mjqu17r6k1gjrdirdhl7a602 [at] 4ax.com...
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>>--- This is all very true. But where the problem could lie between
>>someone like Theron against Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what
>>went on with the consideration process involving Theron, but I would
>>bet that if there was a film test of the two together, her bone
>>structure may've worked against his, making her look broader than she
>>should be next to him, because he himself doesn't really have that
>>broad a bone structure, at least he doesn't scan that way on film.
>>Height may not be an issue, but bone structure may. Then again, it may
>>not be so for certain other roles, but for Bond, that may be an
>>important consideration for a particular Bond girl role, one that can't
>>be really seen till it's tested on film. That's my guess.
>
>
> You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. Did you even read
> what "Dude" wrote?

I don't think he's kidding.

Tom Zielinski
"...Bond's eyes narrowed. He knew, at some point, he would have to slay this
particular dragon. He settled back in his chair, removing a Morlands' three
ring special from the gunmetal cigarette case. As he waited for the
delicious Balkan/Turkish blend to take effect on his lungs, he reflected
that today it's Italy, 2-1..."

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298377 ]

So, 09 Juli 2006 18:08

Rich Handley wrote:
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
> >--- This is all very true. But where the problem could lie between
> >someone like Theron against Craig is in bone structure. Who knows what
> >went on with the consideration process involving Theron, but I would
> >bet that if there was a film test of the two together, her bone
> >structure may've worked against his, making her look broader than she
> >should be next to him, because he himself doesn't really have that
> >broad a bone structure, at least he doesn't scan that way on film.
> >Height may not be an issue, but bone structure may. Then again, it may
> >not be so for certain other roles, but for Bond, that may be an
> >important consideration for a particular Bond girl role, one that can't
> >be really seen till it's tested on film. That's my guess.
>
>
> You're kidding, right? Please tell me you're kidding. Did you even read
> what "Dude" wrote?

--- You know nothing about photography, do you? Height is one thing,
breadth is something else. If you want people to match up in a certain
way, breadth matters more than height, since you can fool people with
height, but the camera's eye can be very unflattering if there's a
discrepancy in the breadth between subjects. One's bone structure
played off another person's different structure can be more evident on
film than in real life, in much the same manner that when you sometimes
look at a picture of yourself you see things you never noticed when
looking at your own reflection in a mirror. It's like when women
complain about how fat they look in pictures, when in fact they might
look perfectly normal just standing right next to you. Film fine-tunes
what you see and is a much more objective reflection of things than
your own vision.

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298408 ]

Mo, 10 Juli 2006 03:20

phil.gerrard1

WQ wrote:

> Film fine-tunes
> what you see and is a much more objective reflection of things than
> your own vision.

Absolute rubbish. The whole point of the filmed image with regard to
drama is that a director has the power to manipulate images to whatever
effect he or she pleases. There's nothing 'objective' about it at all.

Basic reading, almost a century old: Eisenstein's 'The Film Sense'.

Basic watching: any film made since 1903.

Best

Phil

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298411 ]

Mo, 10 Juli 2006 04:04

Rich Handley

"WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>--- You know nothing about photography, do you?

Well, apart from being a magazine editor who often takes professional
photographs and prepare others' photos for publication...no, nothing at
all.

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298415 ]

Mo, 10 Juli 2006 05:26

phil.gerrard [at] ntlworld.com wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> > Film fine-tunes
> > what you see and is a much more objective reflection of things than
> > your own vision.
>
> Absolute rubbish. The whole point of the filmed image with regard to
> drama is that a director has the power to manipulate images to whatever
> effect he or she pleases. There's nothing 'objective' about it at all.

--- Well, he's certainly going to spend an extraordinary amount of time
on special effects to ensure that one's bone structure doesn't
negatively clash with another's from one shot to the next throughout
the whole movie - unless they're meant to clash. You did see What's New
Pussycat, didn't you? Take Woody Allen and put him against Ursula
Andress and note the comical effect. Works great for comedy, but if
you're trying to be serious, you don't put the two together, unless
there's a specific dramatic reason for it.

> Basic reading, almost a century old: Eisenstein's 'The Film Sense'.

--- I'm having difficulty just reading comic books these days.

> Basic watching: any film made since 1903.

--- Visual differences on screen:
Connery - perhaps the most ideally built Bond.
Lazenby - built well for Bond but somehow appears a bit taller than
Connery and narrower or sleeker as well, but fit nevertheless.
Moore - the broadest built Bond, perhaps too heavy looking; has the
height, but the width is a bit much.
Dalton - a standard issue looking Bond, perhaps too standard; compared
to the preceding three, appears shorter and the most pedestrian but
trim.
Brosnan - somewhat on a par with Dalton and a bit too slim early on;
he's managed to fill out over the years, though, but still falls short
of being as imposing as either of the first 3.
Craig - another standard issue type who appears as the shortest of them
all, even at 6 ft., he must be small-boned for a 6 footer compared to
Brosnan and Dalton's medium-boned frame and Connery, Lazenby and
Moore's large-boned look.

The difference among all of them is their bone structures which
contribute to their looking their height or not looking their height,
being narrower or broader in scope, all of which is amplified by film
whther you like to know that or not. I always thought Geena Davis was
a tall actress, and she is. But I thought she was 5'9" or 5'10", which
is what she looks like to me on screen. She's actually 6 ft. Then
there's Paul Newman. He's someone I viewed as 5'11" or a small 6 ft,
sort of like Craig. He's just 5'9". Catherine Zeta-Jones looked like
5'5" or 5'6" to me, 5'4" opposite Sean Connery in Entrapment. She's
5'8 1/2," which certainly surprised me. Check this out for others and
surprise yourself in the process:

http://www.usedwigs.com/lists_08.html

>
> Best
>
> Phil

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298416 ]

Mo, 10 Juli 2006 05:35

Rich Handley wrote:
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
> >--- You know nothing about photography, do you?
>
> Well, apart from being a magazine editor who often takes professional
> photographs and prepare others' photos for publication...no, nothing at
> all.

--- Apparently. What magazine and I'll tell you for sure.

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298429 ]

Mo, 10 Juli 2006 14:30

Tom Zielinski

"Rich Handley" <rhandley [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
news:kad3b2p7a5nlbvmcg3cois6bnefruc249s [at] 4ax.com...
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>>--- You know nothing about photography, do you?
>
> Well, apart from being a magazine editor who often takes professional
> photographs and prepare others' photos for publication...no, nothing at
> all.

LOL!

Tom

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298463 ]

Di, 11 Juli 2006 01:20

Rich Handley

"Tom Zielinski" <rtomz [at] comcast.net> said:
>"Rich Handley" <rhandley [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
>news:kad3b2p7a5nlbvmcg3cois6bnefruc249s [at] 4ax.com...
>> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>>>--- You know nothing about photography, do you?
>> Well, apart from being a magazine editor who often takes professional
>> photographs and prepare others' photos for publication...no, nothing at
>> all.
>LOL!

<<bowing>>

Thank you, sir.

Re: www.mi6.co.uk reveals candidiates considered for Vesper [message #298467 ]

Di, 11 Juli 2006 03:17

Rich Handley wrote:
> "Tom Zielinski" <rtomz [at] comcast.net> said:
> >"Rich Handley" <rhandley [at] optonline.net> wrote in message
> >news:kad3b2p7a5nlbvmcg3cois6bnefruc249s [at] 4ax.com...
> >> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
> >>>--- You know nothing about photography, do you?
> >> Well, apart from being a magazine editor who often takes professional
> >> photographs and prepare others' photos for publication...no, nothing at
> >> all.
> >LOL!
>
> <<bowing>>
>
> Thank you, sir.

--- Cheating on the bows and gratitude. You still haven't mentioned
which magazine.

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