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Fantasy » alt.fan.pratchett » Backwards time
| Backwards time [message #287486] |
Di, 13 Juni 2006 21:45 |
|
Saw this at
http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
(BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
in front and the future behind. Was Terry aware of this when he created
the troll understanding of time, or was he just incredibly astute as
usual?
The original story that BoingBoing links to is at
http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/backsfuture06.asp
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287487 ] |
Di, 13 Juni 2006 21:54 |
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On 13 Jun 2006 12:45:23 -0700, swmurphy [at] gmail.com wrote:
>Saw this at
> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
>(BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
>related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
>in front and the future behind. Was Terry aware of this when he created
>the troll understanding of time, or was he just incredibly astute as
>usual?
>
>The original story that BoingBoing links to is at
>http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/backsfuture06.asp
Yeah, that's old. What I don't understand is how the past can be in
front of the future, unless they mean that the tribe think that next
year is going to be the year before this one, or whatever :)
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287491 ] |
Di, 13 Juni 2006 22:32 |
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"Lister" <fache [at] SPAMclara.net> wrote in message
news:sq5u82p538kqp294r1fd30l3jcm4difl8v [at] 4ax.com...
> On 13 Jun 2006 12:45:23 -0700, swmurphy [at] gmail.com wrote:
>
>>Saw this at
>> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
>>(BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
>>related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
>>in front and the future behind. Was Terry aware of this when he
>>created
>>the troll understanding of time, or was he just incredibly astute as
>>usual?
>>
>>The original story that BoingBoing links to is at
>>http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/backsfuture06.asp
>
>
> Yeah, that's old. What I don't understand is how the past can be in
> front of the future, unless they mean that the tribe think that next
> year is going to be the year before this one, or whatever :)
As the article says its an evidential based language, in other words the
past has been seen whereas the future hasn't, and as it goes on to say
it is not an uncommon concept but what is different is the associated
unconscious gestures which equate the future to being behind the speaker
and the past in front which further emphasises the linguistic
distinction. It also shows a mind set where fortune telling would tend
to be regarded with even less enthusiasm than it is by the majority in
the western world, but where a knowledge of history would be prized,
there would also be a corresponding lack in forward planning. As to how
they view calendar time, it is not mentioned but there is nothing in the
article to lead one to think that they regard time as reversed other
than that until the "tick" occurs to them it would not exist even in
potentia.
One way of looking at it is that we live in the top bowl of the
hourglass whilst they live in the bottom - until that grain of sand hits
the pile in their bit it isn't known about whereas we can see the dip in
the sand getting bigger in ours.
Steve
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287549 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 07:04 |
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in article sq5u82p538kqp294r1fd30l3jcm4difl8v [at] 4ax.com, Lister at
fache [at] SPAMclara.net wrote on 13/06/2006 12:54 PM:
> On 13 Jun 2006 12:45:23 -0700, swmurphy [at] gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Saw this at
>> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
>> (BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
>> related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
>> in front and the future behind. Was Terry aware of this when he created
>> the troll understanding of time, or was he just incredibly astute as
>> usual?
>>
>> The original story that BoingBoing links to is at
>> http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/backsfuture06.asp
>
>
> Yeah, that's old. What I don't understand is how the past can be in
> front of the future, unless they mean that the tribe think that next
> year is going to be the year before this one, or whatever :)
I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
--
Lesley Weston.
Brightly_coloured_blob is real, but I don't often check even the few bits
that get through Yahoo's filters. To reach me, use leswes att shaw dott ca,
changing spelling and spacing as required.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287570 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 09:56 |
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On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 05:04:22 GMT, Lesley Weston
<brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
The meetings, and all other events, are travelling along the road towards
you. When they move forward, they get closer.
....maybe?
-SteveD
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287597 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 12:10 |
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On Tue, 13 Jun 2006 12:45:23 -0700, swmurphy wrote:
> Saw this at
> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
IIRC TP mentioned one of the Disworld religions (not trolls) who also
count backwards. He said "Nobody knows why, but it might not be a good
idea to hang around to find out!"
Kind regards,
Julian
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287615 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 14:52 |
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Lesley Weston <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've
> moved the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it
> will be earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the
> road" to me.
I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of five".
Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
Regards,
--
*Art
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287629 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 16:14 |
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Arthur Hagen wrote:
> Lesley Weston <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've
>> moved the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean
>> it will be earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead
>> along the road" to me.
>
> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of
> five". Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
1650. Just remember that the last digit they say is the hour, and adjust by
the other number.
--
4th swordswoman of the afpocalypse, AFPMinister of Flexible Weapons,
Bondage-happy predator, Speaker-To-Students, SadoMangoist,
AFPMistress to peachy, 8'FED's AFPDeliciousSnack, AFPFiance to A.
Nevill , Graycat's Guttersnipe
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287681 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 18:46 |
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swmurphy [at] gmail.com wrote:
> Saw this at
> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
> (BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
> related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
> in front and the future behind. Was Terry aware of this when he created
> the troll understanding of time, or was he just incredibly astute as
> usual?
That works for me if they are traveling backwards. Dunno about Terry,
but I'll bet he came up with the idea on his own.
If they are traveling backwards, it's our situation too, since we can
"see" the past, but not the future.
> The original story that BoingBoing links to is at
> http://ucsdnews.ucsd.edu/newsrel/soc/backsfuture06.asp
-Rocky
--
O'Toole's Corollary: Murphy was an optimist.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287688 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 19:13 |
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Lesley Weston wrote:
> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
> the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
> earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
Say! If you paraphrased that, it might make a good blues song for Eric
Clapton!
-Rocky
--
O'Toole's Corollary: Murphy was an optimist.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287742 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 21:39 |
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On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 14:14:26 GMT, Anastasia wrote in
<6RUjg.12890$921.8072 [at] newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net>, seen in
alt.fan.pratchett:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
[...]
> > I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of
> > five". Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
> 1650. Just remember that the last digit they say is the hour, and adjust by
> the other number.
In "old fart" mode, what's wrong with the obvious "ten *to* five"?
Much clearer...
--
Ross, in Lincoln, most likely being cynical or sarcastic, as ever.
Reply-to will bounce. Replace the junk-trap with my name to e-mail me.
Demonstration of poor photography: <http://www.rosspix.me.uk> - updated with NL & LU pix
AD: <http://www.merciacharters.co.uk> for European charters occasionally gripped by me
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287798 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 23:31 |
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"Anastasia" <house_damodred [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
> > I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of
> > five". Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
> 1650. Just remember that the last digit they say is the hour, and adjust by
> the other number.
Yes, but adjust _which way_? The sane thing is to say (and ask for)
either ten to five or ten past five, not ten "of" five, whatever that
means and whatever language it's supposed to be.
Richard
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287816 ] |
Mi, 14 Juni 2006 23:50 |
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Anastasia <house_damodred [at] yahoo.com> wrote:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
>>
>> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of
>> five". Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
> 1650. Just remember that the last digit they say is the hour, and
> adjust by the other number.
Yes, but which *way*?
Then they say "night of the 25th", which does *not* mean the night preceding
the day of the 25th... So in one case "of" means "before" and in another
case it means "after"?
"Twentyone fifty UTC" works well for me. :-)
Regards,
--
*Art
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287901 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 05:21 |
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in article i7gv82l0gbfvsgo06ifca7395tn4ungrgf [at] 4ax.com, geminii [at] tpg.com.au at
geminii [at] tpg.com.au wrote on 14/06/2006 12:56 AM:
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 05:04:22 GMT, Lesley Weston
> <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>> the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>> earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>
> The meetings, and all other events, are travelling along the road towards
> you. When they move forward, they get closer.
>
> ...maybe?
That's just as valid, of course, but it's the reverse of the way I see it -
to me it's me that's travelling, not the events.
--
Lesley Weston.
Brightly_coloured_blob is real, but I don't often check even the few bits
that get through Yahoo's filters. To reach me, use leswes att shaw dott ca,
changing spelling and spacing as required.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287903 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 05:24 |
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in article e6p0pm$3ct$1 [at] tree.broomstick.com, Arthur Hagen at
art [at] broomstick.com wrote on 14/06/2006 5:52 AM:
> Lesley Weston <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've
>> moved the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it
>> will be earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the
>> road" to me.
>
> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of five".
> Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
In English English, people don't say that. They say "ten to five" or "ten
past five".
--
Lesley Weston.
Brightly_coloured_blob is real, but I don't often check even the few bits
that get through Yahoo's filters. To reach me, use leswes att shaw dott ca,
changing spelling and spacing as required.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287904 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 05:26 |
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in article 1tXjg.231959$5Z.223893 [at] dukeread02, Rocky Frisco at
rocknatural [at] gmail.com wrote on 14/06/2006 10:13 AM:
> Lesley Weston wrote:
>
>> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>> the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>> earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>
> Say! If you paraphrased that, it might make a good blues song for Eric
> Clapton!
I hate to admit it, but...
?
--
Lesley Weston.
Brightly_coloured_blob is real, but I don't often check even the few bits
that get through Yahoo's filters. To reach me, use leswes att shaw dott ca,
changing spelling and spacing as required.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287952 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 11:20 |
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Arthur Hagen wrote:
<snip>
> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of five".
> Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
I once had a travel guide who said that. "Be back at the coach for ten
of three." So we said "Do you mean ten *to* three or ten *past*
three?" and she looked at us and said "Ten *of* three." Which was
really helpful.
Diane L.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287954 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 12:08 |
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Diane L wrote:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of five".
>>Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
>
> I once had a travel guide who said that. "Be back at the coach for ten
> of three." So we said "Do you mean ten *to* three or ten *past*
> three?" and she looked at us and said "Ten *of* three." Which was
> really helpful.
That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
"Do you mean ten to three?"
"No, fifteen-ten." or "Yes, fourteen-fifty."
Makes life so much easier.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287957 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 12:26 |
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On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
<perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
European, eh?
What time is 'half four'?
--
Andy Brown
Whoever said that men think about sex every 15 seconds was grossly misusing
the word "think".
David Chapman on afp
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287958 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 12:36 |
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On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:26:48 +0000 (UTC), jester
<usenet [at] jester.nu> jotted down:
>On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
><perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
>
>European, eh?
>
>What time is 'half four'?
four-thirty.
--
Elin
The Tale of Westala and Villtin
http://tale.cunobaros.com/
The Oswalds DW casting award - Vote Now!
http://www.student.lu.se/~his02ero/Oswald/index.html
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287963 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 12:58 |
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jester wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
> <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
>
>
> European, eh?
>
> What time is 'half four'?
1630 in Scotland, 1530 in Sweden.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287972 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 13:50 |
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"Torak" <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:l3bkg.2303$YI3.1346 [at] amstwist00...
> jester wrote:
>> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
>> <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is
>>>handy.
>>
>>
>> European, eh?
>>
>> What time is 'half four'?
>
> 1630 in Scotland, 1530 in Sweden.
>
Am or pm was that again? ;-)
Steve
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287973 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 13:54 |
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In article <slrne92df8.t2b.usenet [at] angel.jester.nu>, jester says...
> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
> <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
>
> European, eh?
>
> What time is 'half four'?
fifteen thirty when it is in the afternoon, three thirty if it's in the
middle of the night.
--
PleegWat
Remove caps to reply
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| Re: Backwards time [message #287976 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 14:07 |
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Steve Rogers wrote:
> "Torak" <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>jester wrote:
>>>On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
>>>
>>>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is
>>>>handy.
>>>
>>>European, eh?
>>>
>>>What time is 'half four'?
>>
>>1630 in Scotland, 1530 in Sweden.
>
> Am or pm was that again? ;-)
Oh, I just assumed that being awake was a prerequisite. :-)
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288000 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 16:24 |
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Lesley Weston wrote:
> in article i7gv82l0gbfvsgo06ifca7395tn4ungrgf [at] 4ax.com, geminii [at] tpg.com.au at
> geminii [at] tpg.com.au wrote on 14/06/2006 12:56 AM:
>
>
>>On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 05:04:22 GMT, Lesley Weston
>><brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>>>stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>>>the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>>>earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>>
>>The meetings, and all other events, are travelling along the road towards
>>you. When they move forward, they get closer.
>>
>>...maybe?
>
>
> That's just as valid, of course, but it's the reverse of the way I see it -
> to me it's me that's travelling, not the events.
>
Except when they move the meeting forward, clearly it's traveling too.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288001 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 16:16 |
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Lesley Weston <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> in article e6p0pm$3ct$1 [at] tree.broomstick.com, Arthur Hagen at
> art [at] broomstick.com wrote on 14/06/2006 5:52 AM:
>
>> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of
>> five". Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
> In English English, people don't say that. They say "ten to five" or
> "ten past five".
Or ten oh-five, which must not be confused with the New World ten of five...
Regards,
--
*Art
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288002 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 16:17 |
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jester <usenet [at] jester.nu> wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
> <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is
>> handy.
>
> European, eh?
>
> What time is 'half four'?
Two.
Regards,
--
*Art
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| Re: [R] Backwards time [message #288034 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 19:01 |
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CeltiKaos:
> swmurphy:
>>
>> Saw this at
>> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
>
> IIRC TP mentioned one of the Disworld religions (not trolls) who also
> count backwards. He said "Nobody knows why, but it might not be a good
> idea to hang around to find out!"
Trolls _perceive_ time as flowing from behind to in front. At least
one religion _counts_ down. There's no "also" about it. :-)
--
\\\\ Jens Ayton, Fratello di Vetinari 36.3636363636364% insane
\\\\\__, Bringing sarcastic one-liners to the common hedgehog since 1999
\\\\\`/
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288044 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 19:21 |
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On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:17:53 -0400, "Arthur Hagen"
<art [at] broomstick.com> wrote:
>jester <usenet [at] jester.nu> wrote:
>> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
>> <perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is
>>> handy.
>>
>> European, eh?
>>
>> What time is 'half four'?
>
>Two.
Heh, no, it's 4:30 (or 16:30, if you want)
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288053 ] |
Do, 15 Juni 2006 20:09 |
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On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 17:50:24 -0400, Arthur Hagen wrote:
> "Twentyone fifty UTC" works well for me. :-)
>
> Regards,
Ditto. I use 24hr clock that way too. Less chance of cockups.. unless of
course they think you said 'fifteen' and not 'fifty' :)
Kind regards,
Julian
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288151 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 03:32 |
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Lesley Weston wrote:
> in article 1tXjg.231959$5Z.223893 [at] dukeread02, Rocky Frisco at
> rocknatural [at] gmail.com wrote on 14/06/2006 10:13 AM:
>
>
>>Lesley Weston wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>>>stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>>>the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>>>earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>>
>>Say! If you paraphrased that, it might make a good blues song for Eric
>>Clapton!
>
>
> I hate to admit it, but...
>
> ?
"Further on down the road."
"Somebody's gonna hurt you like you hurt me."
-Rocky
--
O'Toole's Corollary: Murphy was an optimist.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288155 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 03:54 |
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in article 44ekg.17078$Bj6.621 [at] trnddc08, peachy ashie passion at
exquisitepeach [at] hotmail.com wrote on 15/06/2006 7:24 AM:
> Lesley Weston wrote:
>
>> in article i7gv82l0gbfvsgo06ifca7395tn4ungrgf [at] 4ax.com, geminii [at] tpg.com.au at
>> geminii [at] tpg.com.au wrote on 14/06/2006 12:56 AM:
>>
>>
>>> On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 05:04:22 GMT, Lesley Weston
>>> <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>>>> stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>>>> the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>>>> earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>>>
>>> The meetings, and all other events, are travelling along the road towards
>>> you. When they move forward, they get closer.
>>>
>>> ...maybe?
>>
>>
>> That's just as valid, of course, but it's the reverse of the way I see it -
>> to me it's me that's travelling, not the events.
>>
>
>
> Except when they move the meeting forward, clearly it's traveling too.
That's the way *they* visualise time (whoever *they* might be), which is the
opposite of the way I see it; I would say "The meeting will be earlier". In
my world, meetings and other events don't move but people do, all of us
along the one road, so we'll reach the meeting sooner.
--
Lesley Weston.
Brightly_coloured_blob is real, but I don't often check even the few bits
that get through Yahoo's filters. To reach me, use leswes att shaw dott ca,
changing spelling and spacing as required.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288160 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 04:20 |
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Lesley Weston wrote:
> in article 44ekg.17078$Bj6.621 [at] trnddc08, peachy ashie passion at
> exquisitepeach [at] hotmail.com wrote on 15/06/2006 7:24 AM:
>>
>>Except when they move the meeting forward, clearly it's traveling too.
>
>
> That's the way *they* visualise time (whoever *they* might be), which is the
> opposite of the way I see it; I would say "The meeting will be earlier". In
> my world, meetings and other events don't move but people do, all of us
> along the one road, so we'll reach the meeting sooner.
>
See, I am totally with you until that last bit.
Moving it forward is to me too, moving it later rather than earlier.
I get that mixed up often and have since learned to clarify - and to
repeat it properly inside my head a few times so that it will be
remembered in my head the way it makes sense to me (The meeting will be
earlier). But when they move the meeting, they move they meeting. In
my head, I mean. I have a little visual of an object being picked up
and moved on the road to a closer point.
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| Re: [I] Backwards time [message #288201 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 07:29 |
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Diane L wrote:
> Arthur Hagen wrote:
>> I have a problem when people say things like "see you at ten of five".
>> Do they men 16:50 or 17:10?
>
> I once had a travel guide who said that. "Be back at the coach for ten
> of three." So we said "Do you mean ten *to* three or ten *past*
> three?" and she looked at us and said "Ten *of* three." Which was
> really helpful.
<eats travel guide>
There you go. Revenge. My gift to you.
Adrian.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288210 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 08:18 |
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Graycat wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:26:48 +0000 (UTC), jester
> <usenet [at] jester.nu> jotted down:
>
>
>>On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
>><perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
>>
>>European, eh?
>>
>>What time is 'half four'?
> four-thirty.
I think that's short for "half of four" so I would say three thirty.
half = "half hour"
of = before
-Rocky
--
O'Toole's Corollary: Murphy was an optimist.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288211 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 08:26 |
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Rocky Frisco <rocknatural [at] gmail.com> writes:
> Graycat wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:26:48 +0000 (UTC), jester
> > <usenet [at] jester.nu> jotted down:
> >
> >>On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 12:08:52 +0200, Torak
> >><perry_awm [at] hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>>That's where military (or, to my mind at least, European) time is handy.
> >>
> >>European, eh?
> >>
> >>What time is 'half four'?
>
> > four-thirty.
>
> I think that's short for "half of four" so I would say three thirty.
>
> half = "half hour"
>
> of = before
That's true in Germany, but around here it's short for 'around tea time.'
Damn clocks ain't going to tyrannise me!
Matthew
--
Dr Matthew J Seaman MA, D.Phil. 7 Priory Courtyard
Flat 3
PGP: http://www.infracaninophile.co.uk/pgpkey Ramsgate
Kent, CT11 9PW
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| Re: [I] Backwards time [message #288220 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 09:10 |
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Rocky Frisco wrote:
> I think that's short for "half of four" so I would say three thirty.
>
> half = "half hour"
> of = before
Of does not mean before. Not ever, in English. (Can't speak for other
languages, including those whose speakers erroneously believe
themselves to be speaking English.)
I think what you're saying is that just as "half intellect of Rocky"
means "less intellect than Rocky", so "half of four" means "earlier
than four". Except that by that logic, half of four ought to mean two.
Perhaps a better way to look at it is that "half of four" means
"halfway through hour number four". That is to say, "The time at which
/half/ /of/ the minutes belonging to the /four/th hour have passed".
If hour number one goes from 12-1, then hour number four goes from
3-4, and halfway through that hour is 3:30.
Yes, that's probably how it's meant to be understood.
However, where it's confusing is that in this digital age, the hour
most readily associated with the number "four" is not the "fourth hour
after twelve", but instead the hour during which the time begins with
the digit 4 on real (i.e. digital) clocks. That is to say, from
4:00:00 to 4:59:99 inclusive. So digitally speaking, "half of four"
ought to mean "half past four".
Adrian.
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288232 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 09:50 |
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Rocky Frisco wrote:
> Graycat wrote:
>> On Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:26:48 +0000 (UTC), jester
>>>
>>> What time is 'half four'?
>
>> four-thirty.
>
> I think that's short for "half of four" so I would say three thirty.
>
> half = "half hour"
>
> of = before
In Britain it's short for "half [past] four". Very common in Scotland,
at least in the southwest.
I don't think I've ever heard this "of" thing, though. Even on American
TV, even though they tend to use that horrific construction "twenty
after four". "Past" or "to" - the two true ways!
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288243 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 10:12 |
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swmurphy [at] gmail.com <swmurphy [at] gmail.com> wrote:
> Saw this at
> http://www.boingboing.net/2006/06/13/aymara_peoples_rever.ht ml
> (BoingBoing) - apparently the Aymara people of South America are
> related to Discworld Trolls - their conception of time places the past
> in front and the future behind. [...]
<insert std joke of backwards people here>
Very interesting.
Schobi
--
SpamTrap [at] gmx.de is never read
I'm Schobi at suespammers dot org
"The sarcasm is mightier than the sword."
Eric Jarvis
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| Re: Backwards time [message #288244 ] |
Fr, 16 Juni 2006 10:14 |
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geminii [at] tpg.com.au <geminii [at] tpg.com.au> wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Jun 2006 05:04:22 GMT, Lesley Weston
> <brightly_coloured_blob [at] yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>I don't know if it's the same thing, but I see time a sort of road
>>stretching out in front of me and behind me. When people say "We've moved
>>the meeting forward", I have to remind myself that they mean it will be
>>earlier, not later - "forward" means "further ahead along the road" to me.
>
> The meetings, and all other events, are travelling along the road towards
> you. When they move forward, they get closer.
>
> ...maybe?
Maybe. Except, there's only one direction you can move
along the road of time. The meeting will have to obey
to that direction, too.
> -SteveD
Schobi
--
SpamTrap [at] gmx.de is never read
I'm Schobi at suespammers dot org
"The sarcasm is mightier than the sword."
Eric Jarvis
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