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Miscellaneous / Verschiedenes » alt.fan.james-bond » Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB
Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248165] Mo, 17 April 2006 00:15
jeffwahlman  
This includes spoiling the finale sequence, so you have been warned.

http://www.ajb007.co.uk/index.php?topic=25478
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248166 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 00:20
booby  
Not sure Bond dying at the end will go down with Joe Public. A joint
suicide in a Bond film? Interesting.

:)

MMS
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248173 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 04:03
jeffwahlman  
Okay, the guy got cold feet and yanked it... here's my summary of what
was previously posted. Blame/Thank "Agent Spriggan Ominae" for this
getting out.





MAJOR





SPOILERS


INCLUDING



THE


ENDING



YOU


HAVE


BEEN


WARNED


- Opening cuts back and forth between Bond's first 007 kills, end of
the PTS is a real life gunbarrell. Not confirmed, but the blood is
probably the first color we see
- Bond stops Demitrius from blowing up a Boeing 777 prototype airplane
in Miami. There's some kind of jump between a fuel tanker and the
plane.
- Solange is found dead via torture, Bond and M have a serious
discussion over her dead body.
- A few gadgets, mostly trackers and cell phones (a *LOT* of cell phone
stuff)
- Bond gets a tracker put into his hand, as rumored
- Bond does get poisoned during the poker game, as rumored

- The finale:

Bond and Vesper are on Holiday in Venice. M lets Bond know they still
haven't gotten the Poker winnings transferred over. Vesper presumably
turns up missing... Bond remembers she has the account # and PIN for
the account the money is in. He may get a tip that some of the money
has been transferred, memory is hazy. Bond finds her being taken by
two villains not mentioned in any script reviews (maybe the guys who
kill LeChiffre?). Anyway, Bond shoots one of them, but he has a
bulletproof vest. He and Bond have a big fight, Bond finally kills
him. He and the other dude end up fighting in a Venice building and
somehow end up blowing up the foundation of the building (the review
said something about an airbag?). Anyway, the building collapses into
the canal and starts flooding. Finally Bond kills the 2nd dude...
Vesper is trapped in a gated elevator and the shaft is rapidly flooding
(guessing the ceiling where Bond is at is higher and he's not in
danger). He and Vesper kiss through the bars... Bond tries to give her
mouth to mouth as the water presumably gets above her head, but Vesper
pulls away and drowns herself. Bond goes crazy trying to break her
out, he finally does but it's too late. Bond breaks down as the
mysterious Mr. White is shown watching on.

Extremely positive, as most of the reviews have been.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248174 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 05:10
WQ  
jeffwahlman [at] gmail.com wrote:
> Okay, the guy got cold feet and yanked it... here's my summary of what
> was previously posted. Blame/Thank "Agent Spriggan Ominae" for this
> getting out.
>
>
>
>
>
> MAJOR
>
>
>
>
>
> SPOILERS
>
>
> INCLUDING
>
>
>
> THE
>
>
> ENDING
>
>
>
> YOU
>
>
> HAVE
>
>
> BEEN
>
>
> WARNED
>
>
> - Opening cuts back and forth between Bond's first 007 kills, end of
> the PTS is a real life gunbarrell. Not confirmed, but the blood is
> probably the first color we see
> - Bond stops Demitrius from blowing up a Boeing 777 prototype airplane
> in Miami. There's some kind of jump between a fuel tanker and the
> plane.
> - Solange is found dead via torture, Bond and M have a serious
> discussion over her dead body.
> - A few gadgets, mostly trackers and cell phones (a *LOT* of cell phone
> stuff)

--- Yikes! We're not going to be seeing another episode of 24, are we?

> - Bond gets a tracker put into his hand, as rumored
> - Bond does get poisoned during the poker game, as rumored
>
> - The finale:
>
> Bond and Vesper are on Holiday in Venice. M lets Bond know they still
> haven't gotten the Poker winnings transferred over. Vesper presumably
> turns up missing... Bond remembers she has the account # and PIN for
> the account the money is in. He may get a tip that some of the money
> has been transferred, memory is hazy. Bond finds her being taken by
> two villains not mentioned in any script reviews (maybe the guys who
> kill LeChiffre?). Anyway, Bond shoots one of them, but he has a
> bulletproof vest. He and Bond have a big fight, Bond finally kills
> him. He and the other dude end up fighting in a Venice building and
> somehow end up blowing up the foundation of the building (the review
> said something about an airbag?). Anyway, the building collapses into
> the canal and starts flooding. Finally Bond kills the 2nd dude...
> Vesper is trapped in a gated elevator and the shaft is rapidly flooding
> (guessing the ceiling where Bond is at is higher and he's not in
> danger). He and Vesper kiss through the bars... Bond tries to give her
> mouth to mouth as the water presumably gets above her head, but Vesper
> pulls away and drowns herself. Bond goes crazy trying to break her
> out, he finally does but it's too late. Bond breaks down as the
> mysterious Mr. White is shown watching on.

--- That's it? She drowns herself? No suicide? No "The bitch is
dead?" Either this an Easter prank or one great big disappointment.

> Extremely positive, as most of the reviews have been.

--- Clue me in where I should find extreme positivity in this. They
killed the ending, and that kills the movie. Assuming what you just
wrote is legit.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248175 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 09:41
The Shadow  
I do not know about this.

If it is true why change it from the book?

Odd, very odd.









jeffwahlman [at] gmail.com wrote:
> Okay, the guy got cold feet and yanked it... here's my summary of what
> was previously posted. Blame/Thank "Agent Spriggan Ominae" for this
> getting out.
>
>
>
>
>
> MAJOR
>
>
>
>
>
> SPOILERS
>
>
> INCLUDING
>
>
>
> THE
>
>
> ENDING
>
>
>
> YOU
>
>
> HAVE
>
>
> BEEN
>
>
> WARNED
>
>
> - Opening cuts back and forth between Bond's first 007 kills, end of
> the PTS is a real life gunbarrell. Not confirmed, but the blood is
> probably the first color we see
> - Bond stops Demitrius from blowing up a Boeing 777 prototype airplane
> in Miami. There's some kind of jump between a fuel tanker and the
> plane.
> - Solange is found dead via torture, Bond and M have a serious
> discussion over her dead body.
> - A few gadgets, mostly trackers and cell phones (a *LOT* of cell phone
> stuff)
> - Bond gets a tracker put into his hand, as rumored
> - Bond does get poisoned during the poker game, as rumored
>
> - The finale:
>
> Bond and Vesper are on Holiday in Venice. M lets Bond know they still
> haven't gotten the Poker winnings transferred over. Vesper presumably
> turns up missing... Bond remembers she has the account # and PIN for
> the account the money is in. He may get a tip that some of the money
> has been transferred, memory is hazy. Bond finds her being taken by
> two villains not mentioned in any script reviews (maybe the guys who
> kill LeChiffre?). Anyway, Bond shoots one of them, but he has a
> bulletproof vest. He and Bond have a big fight, Bond finally kills
> him. He and the other dude end up fighting in a Venice building and
> somehow end up blowing up the foundation of the building (the review
> said something about an airbag?). Anyway, the building collapses into
> the canal and starts flooding. Finally Bond kills the 2nd dude...
> Vesper is trapped in a gated elevator and the shaft is rapidly flooding
> (guessing the ceiling where Bond is at is higher and he's not in
> danger). He and Vesper kiss through the bars... Bond tries to give her
> mouth to mouth as the water presumably gets above her head, but Vesper
> pulls away and drowns herself. Bond goes crazy trying to break her
> out, he finally does but it's too late. Bond breaks down as the
> mysterious Mr. White is shown watching on.
>
> Extremely positive, as most of the reviews have been.
>
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248180 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 17:48
WQ  
The Shadow wrote:
> I do not know about this.
>
> If it is true why change it from the book?

--- This is what I feared all along with CR in the hands of the current
EON regime. If it's true.


>
> Odd, very odd.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> jeffwahlman [at] gmail.com wrote:
> > Okay, the guy got cold feet and yanked it... here's my summary of what
> > was previously posted. Blame/Thank "Agent Spriggan Ominae" for this
> > getting out.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > MAJOR
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > SPOILERS
> >
> >
> > INCLUDING
> >
> >
> >
> > THE
> >
> >
> > ENDING
> >
> >
> >
> > YOU
> >
> >
> > HAVE
> >
> >
> > BEEN
> >
> >
> > WARNED
> >
> >
> > - Opening cuts back and forth between Bond's first 007 kills, end of
> > the PTS is a real life gunbarrell. Not confirmed, but the blood is
> > probably the first color we see
> > - Bond stops Demitrius from blowing up a Boeing 777 prototype airplane
> > in Miami. There's some kind of jump between a fuel tanker and the
> > plane.
> > - Solange is found dead via torture, Bond and M have a serious
> > discussion over her dead body.
> > - A few gadgets, mostly trackers and cell phones (a *LOT* of cell phone
> > stuff)
> > - Bond gets a tracker put into his hand, as rumored
> > - Bond does get poisoned during the poker game, as rumored
> >
> > - The finale:
> >
> > Bond and Vesper are on Holiday in Venice. M lets Bond know they still
> > haven't gotten the Poker winnings transferred over. Vesper presumably
> > turns up missing... Bond remembers she has the account # and PIN for
> > the account the money is in. He may get a tip that some of the money
> > has been transferred, memory is hazy. Bond finds her being taken by
> > two villains not mentioned in any script reviews (maybe the guys who
> > kill LeChiffre?). Anyway, Bond shoots one of them, but he has a
> > bulletproof vest. He and Bond have a big fight, Bond finally kills
> > him. He and the other dude end up fighting in a Venice building and
> > somehow end up blowing up the foundation of the building (the review
> > said something about an airbag?). Anyway, the building collapses into
> > the canal and starts flooding. Finally Bond kills the 2nd dude...
> > Vesper is trapped in a gated elevator and the shaft is rapidly flooding
> > (guessing the ceiling where Bond is at is higher and he's not in
> > danger). He and Vesper kiss through the bars... Bond tries to give her
> > mouth to mouth as the water presumably gets above her head, but Vesper
> > pulls away and drowns herself. Bond goes crazy trying to break her
> > out, he finally does but it's too late. Bond breaks down as the
> > mysterious Mr. White is shown watching on.
> >
> > Extremely positive, as most of the reviews have been.
> >
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248182 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 21:02
jeffwahlman  
Yes, because the endings of Dr. No, From Russia With Love, Goldfinger,
and Thunderball films were all exactly like the book, right?
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248183 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 21:18
WQ  
jeffwahlman [at] gmail.com wrote:
> Yes, because the endings of Dr. No, From Russia With Love, Goldfinger,
> and Thunderball films were all exactly like the book, right?

--- Well, considering that everybody here who's all gung-ho on Craig
and somehow believe that EON actually will produce a "faithful" version
of CR because they and Campbell have alluded to all the relevant things
being included in it from the book because they're so crucial to the
understanding of Bond's character and how he came to be who he is and
all that malarky, one would think that the last thing they'd remove
from the original story is how the story really ends. I don't know
about you, but her drowning [and not in suicidal fashon either] really
dilutes the impact on Bond's character and his becoming who he comes to
be. Where's the real sense of betrayal and revenge in that? It's just
as lame as him chasing a free runner who ends up on a construction
crane. Free runners are too smart to corner themselves into a dead-end
situation like a construction crane. I'm too smart to do that and I'm
not even a free runner. I really fear a dumbed-down take on a
"faithful" version [faithful in spirit if not to the written word] of
CR. Here's a chance for EON to do it right and it looks like they're
just going to be slipping back into their old ways again. That's, of
course, if that synopsis is true.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248186 ] Mo, 17 April 2006 22:59
JHause  
WQ wrote:
> --- Well, considering that everybody here who's all gung-ho on Craig
> and somehow believe that EON actually will produce a "faithful" version
> of CR because they and Campbell have alluded to all the relevant things
> being included in it from the book because they're so crucial to the
> understanding of Bond's character and how he came to be who he is and
> all that malarky, one would think that the last thing they'd remove
> from the original story is how the story really ends. I don't know
> about you, but her drowning [and not in suicidal fashon either] really
> dilutes the impact on Bond's character and his becoming who he comes to
> be. Where's the real sense of betrayal and revenge in that? It's just
> as lame as him chasing a free runner who ends up on a construction
> crane. Free runners are too smart to corner themselves into a dead-end
> situation like a construction crane. I'm too smart to do that and I'm
> not even a free runner. I really fear a dumbed-down take on a
> "faithful" version [faithful in spirit if not to the written word] of
> CR. Here's a chance for EON to do it right and it looks like they're
> just going to be slipping back into their old ways again. That's, of
> course, if that synopsis is true.

"The bitch is dead" is the whole book? LOL -- that must be one
incredible "screenplay" that you wrote.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248187 ] Di, 18 April 2006 00:54
The Shadow  
JHause wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>> --- Well, considering that everybody here who's all gung-ho on Craig
>> and somehow believe that EON actually will produce a "faithful" version
>> of CR because they and Campbell have alluded to all the relevant things
>> being included in it from the book because they're so crucial to the
>> understanding of Bond's character and how he came to be who he is and
>> all that malarky, one would think that the last thing they'd remove
>> from the original story is how the story really ends. I don't know
>> about you, but her drowning [and not in suicidal fashon either] really
>> dilutes the impact on Bond's character and his becoming who he comes to
>> be. Where's the real sense of betrayal and revenge in that? It's just
>> as lame as him chasing a free runner who ends up on a construction
>> crane. Free runners are too smart to corner themselves into a dead-end
>> situation like a construction crane. I'm too smart to do that and I'm
>> not even a free runner. I really fear a dumbed-down take on a
>> "faithful" version [faithful in spirit if not to the written word] of
>> CR. Here's a chance for EON to do it right and it looks like they're
>> just going to be slipping back into their old ways again. That's, of
>> course, if that synopsis is true.
>
> "The bitch is dead" is the whole book? LOL -- that must be one
> incredible "screenplay" that you wrote.



Bond faced the ultimate betrayal in Fleming's first book and it explains
his character a great deal.

With "re-telling" all we are left with is a killing machine that has no
soul.

Yeah, in a way "the bitch is dead" is the whole book.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #248188 ] Di, 18 April 2006 00:56
The Shadow  
jeffwahlman [at] gmail.com wrote:
> Yes, because the endings of Dr. No, From Russia With Love, Goldfinger,
> and Thunderball films were all exactly like the book, right?




No, and that is a shame.

Just look at the hack job they did with You Only Live Twice.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254444 ] Di, 18 April 2006 10:30
JHause  
If it all comes down to saying "the bitch is dead," then yeah -- the
movie WILL suck.

WQ just needs it in there because he hates women and their distorted
genital perspective.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254445 ] Di, 18 April 2006 10:29
Tim Pollard  
"JHause" <JHause [at] aol.com> wrote in message
news:1145349008.505219.221620 [at] z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> If it all comes down to saying "the bitch is dead," then yeah -- the
> movie WILL suck.
>
> WQ just needs it in there because he hates women and their distorted
> genital perspective.



Which is funny, because I'm very fond of the that particular view... <g>



--
Regards

Tim Pollard

www.timpollard.com

A useful unit of measurement: the 'millihelen' is the amount of beauty
needed to launch one ship.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254447 ] Di, 18 April 2006 17:23
WQ  
Tim Pollard wrote:
> "JHause" <JHause [at] aol.com> wrote in message
> news:1145349008.505219.221620 [at] z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> > If it all comes down to saying "the bitch is dead," then yeah -- the
> > movie WILL suck.
> >
> > WQ just needs it in there because he hates women and their distorted
> > genital perspective.
>
>
>
> Which is funny, because I'm very fond of the that particular view... <g>

--- I'm very fond of women's genitals myself, but yes, that gender's
perspective on things can be a little screwy at times, especially when
it comes to choosing a new Bond. I think that's a man's job.


>
>
>
> --
> Regards
>
> Tim Pollard
>
> www.timpollard.com
>
> A useful unit of measurement: the 'millihelen' is the amount of beauty
> needed to launch one ship.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254453 ] Mi, 19 April 2006 18:00
Rich Handley  
"JHause" <JHause [at] aol.com> said:
>WQ just needs it in there because he hates women and their distorted
>genital perspective.

Look, I think WQ needs to take a breath, grab a sandwich and relax as much
as you do, but what you just said above is ridiculous.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254454 ] Mi, 19 April 2006 18:01
Rich Handley  
"WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>--- I'm very fond of women's genitals myself, but yes, that gender's
>perspective on things can be a little screwy at times, especially when
>it comes to choosing a new Bond. I think that's a man's job.

Alright, I compeltely retract the statement I just made about his comment
being ridiculous. He's right -- you ARE a mysogynist. A shame. I was
trying hard to take you seriously, too.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254456 ] Mi, 19 April 2006 18:37
WQ  
Rich Handley wrote:
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
> >--- I'm very fond of women's genitals myself, but yes, that gender's
> >perspective on things can be a little screwy at times, especially when
> >it comes to choosing a new Bond. I think that's a man's job.
>
> Alright, I compeltely retract the statement I just made about his comment
> being ridiculous. He's right -- you ARE a mysogynist. A shame. I was
> trying hard to take you seriously, too.

--- A misogynist? Tell that to the women who know me and can't live
without me. If anything, I can't stand being around guys that much -
if only because they often fail to understand my sense of humor in
Google posts. I thought it was so evident. Guess not. Oh, well, back
to the laughs with the babes.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254458 ] Do, 20 April 2006 00:09
Mac  
Rich Handley wrote:

> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
>> --- I'm very fond of women's genitals myself, but yes, that gender's
>> perspective on things can be a little screwy at times, especially
>> when it comes to choosing a new Bond. I think that's a man's job.
>
> Alright, I compeltely retract the statement I just made about his
> comment being ridiculous. He's right -- you ARE a mysogynist. A
> shame. I was trying hard to take you seriously, too.

It's all the more ridiculous given just how instrumental Dana and Barbara
Broccoli have been in the decision-making of the casting of ALL the
James Bond actors.

--
--Mac

Last film I (re)watched: SALVADOR (1986, Oliver Stone)
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254459 ] Do, 20 April 2006 01:32
WQ  
Mac wrote:
> Rich Handley wrote:
>
> > "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> said:
> >> --- I'm very fond of women's genitals myself, but yes, that gender's
> >> perspective on things can be a little screwy at times, especially
> >> when it comes to choosing a new Bond. I think that's a man's job.
> >
> > Alright, I compeltely retract the statement I just made about his
> > comment being ridiculous. He's right -- you ARE a mysogynist. A
> > shame. I was trying hard to take you seriously, too.
>
> It's all the more ridiculous given just how instrumental Dana and Barbara
> Broccoli have been in the decision-making of the casting of ALL the
> James Bond actors.

--- You're joking, right? Barb is about 45 now, so you're telling me
she would've been instrumental as well in choosing, at the age of 1,
Connery, at the age of 8, Lazenby, at the age of 11, Moore? Or did
you just not write that in a grammatically correct sense.

>
> --
> --Mac
>
> Last film I (re)watched: SALVADOR (1986, Oliver Stone)
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254460 ] Do, 20 April 2006 01:58
Mac  
WQ wrote:

>> It's all the more ridiculous given just how instrumental Dana and
>> Barbara Broccoli have been in the decision-making of the casting of
>> ALL the James Bond actors.
>
> --- You're joking, right? Barb is about 45 now, so you're telling me
> she would've been instrumental as well in choosing, at the age of 1,
> Connery, at the age of 8, Lazenby, at the age of 11, Moore? Or did
> you just not write that in a grammatically correct sense.

Is this one of those "cheap thrill shots" you accuse other people of
making at your expense, or can't you really work it out and would
like me to explain it to you?
--
--Mac
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254463 ] Do, 20 April 2006 03:27
WQ  
Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> >> It's all the more ridiculous given just how instrumental Dana and
> >> Barbara Broccoli have been in the decision-making of the casting of
> >> ALL the James Bond actors.
> >
> > --- You're joking, right? Barb is about 45 now, so you're telling me
> > she would've been instrumental as well in choosing, at the age of 1,
> > Connery, at the age of 8, Lazenby, at the age of 11, Moore? Or did
> > you just not write that in a grammatically correct sense.
>
> Is this one of those "cheap thrill shots" you accuse other people of
> making at your expense, or can't you really work it out and would
> like me to explain it to you?
> --
> --Mac

--- The grammatically correct version: "of their respective James Bond
actors," not "ALL the James Bond actors" with the misleading emphasis
on the capitalized ALL.

But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
who chose who, I'm not sure "instrumental" is how I'd categorize Dana's
involvement, and much less so in Barb's case. Let's face it, it seems
that whoever Cubby had an eye on at the time, it seemed to be pretty
much a done deal for him and all he needed was positive feedback to
validate his choice, from Connery onward. Can Dana or Barb giving
positive feedback be considered instrumental? Hardly.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254470 ] Do, 20 April 2006 10:24
Mac  
WQ wrote:

> But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
> by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
> who chose who, I'm not sure "instrumental" is how I'd categorize
> Dana's involvement, and much less so in Barb's case. Let's face it,
> it seems that whoever Cubby had an eye on at the time, it seemed to
> be pretty much a done deal for him and all he needed was positive
> feedback to validate his choice, from Connery onward. Can Dana or
> Barb giving positive feedback be considered instrumental? Hardly.

Seems Cubby disagrees with you. Read his book.
--
--Mac
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254472 ] Do, 20 April 2006 10:39
Mac  
WQ wrote:

> --- The grammatically correct version: "of their respective James Bond
> actors," not "ALL the James Bond actors" with the misleading emphasis
> on the capitalized ALL.
>
> But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
> by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
> who chose who,

Wouldn't "who chose whom" be grammatically correct here?
--
--Mac
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254477 ] Do, 20 April 2006 17:58
WQ  
Mac wrote:
> WQ wrote:
>
> > --- The grammatically correct version: "of their respective James Bond
> > actors," not "ALL the James Bond actors" with the misleading emphasis
> > on the capitalized ALL.
> >
> > But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
> > by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
> > who chose who,
>
> Wouldn't "who chose whom" be grammatically correct here?
> --
> --Mac

--- Current usage sees a blurring of the lines between who and whom now
if only because whom is rarely used and the manner in which manner it
is used is rarely understood by the peasantry of humanity. Whom would
be correct if I had written "the Bonds whom Barb chose." In other
words, who is used when it's the subject of a verb or predicate pronoun
and whom when it's the object of a verb, as in the cited example, or
prepostion [to whom]. Sometimes it's a bit tricky even for me, as in
within the context I wrote "who chose who," so I resort to my rule of
thumb: when in doubt, stick with who.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254488 ] Fr, 21 April 2006 04:08
James Hunter  
"Mac" <see.mac [at] SPAMLESSvirgin.net> wrote in message
news:4aoup4FudhlcU1 [at] individual.net...
> WQ wrote:
>
> > But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
> > by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
> > who chose who, I'm not sure "instrumental" is how I'd categorize
> > Dana's involvement, and much less so in Barb's case. Let's face it,
> > it seems that whoever Cubby had an eye on at the time, it seemed to
> > be pretty much a done deal for him and all he needed was positive
> > feedback to validate his choice, from Connery onward. Can Dana or
> > Barb giving positive feedback be considered instrumental? Hardly.
>
> Seems Cubby disagrees with you. Read his book.
> --
> --Mac
>

Et voila.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254489 ] Fr, 21 April 2006 06:03
WQ  
James Hunter wrote:
> "Mac" <see.mac [at] SPAMLESSvirgin.net> wrote in message
> news:4aoup4FudhlcU1 [at] individual.net...
> > WQ wrote:
> >
> > > But grammar aside, unless you can correct me otherwise, it seems that
> > > by my reading of whatever material I've come across over the years of
> > > who chose who, I'm not sure "instrumental" is how I'd categorize
> > > Dana's involvement, and much less so in Barb's case. Let's face it,
> > > it seems that whoever Cubby had an eye on at the time, it seemed to
> > > be pretty much a done deal for him and all he needed was positive
> > > feedback to validate his choice, from Connery onward. Can Dana or
> > > Barb giving positive feedback be considered instrumental? Hardly.
> >
> > Seems Cubby disagrees with you. Read his book.

--- I guess I'll have to - if I can find a copy somewhere.

> > --
> > --Mac
> >
>
> Et voila.
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254507 ] Sa, 22 April 2006 17:10
Icebreaker  
"WQ" <wq [at] email.com> wrote in message
news:1145301532.435585.61990 [at] e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...

> I really fear a dumbed-down take on a
> "faithful" version [faithful in spirit if not to the written word] of
> CR. Here's a chance for EON to do it right and it looks like they're
> just going to be slipping back into their old ways again. That's, of
> course, if that synopsis is true.

The synopsis was dead-on. That is how Vesper has been scripted to die. What
Mr.Wahlman's excellent summary just barely touches upon is that Bond could
save Vesper, but she refuses it. How well that will be articulated on the
screen by Campbell remains to be seen. I think there's room for confusion
among audience members if it's not done correctly, but the bottom line is
that yes, indeed, that is the script, that is how Purvis and Wade have her
dying. And by the way, it is Purvis and Wade's scene. Think about it. Bond
has to save Christmas Jones from drowning in the submarine in TWINE. In DAD
Bond saves Jinx from drowning in the melting Ice Palace. And now we have
Bond trying to save Vesper from drowning...and presumeably will be
unsuccessful. See a trend there? Purvis and Wade have some sort of fixation
on drowning women.

I had no allusions that EON would be faithful to Fleming's novel, so this
came as no surprise. I wouldn't even be surprised if EON films alternate
scenes for Vesper's death and Bond's torture scene and uses those on the
dvd, instead choosing to give the theatrical release a more upbeat, happy
ending. Not saying it's going to happen, but something to be mindful of.

-------------------------------------
Icebreaker
"You don't fool me, Ricky. I know all about your kind. Your new student eyes
immediately graze over the firm young flanks of our females, and I won't
have it. Capiche, amigo? There's nothing i'd like better than to put you new
students back on a boat to where you came from."
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254509 ] Sa, 22 April 2006 18:45
WQ  
Icebreaker wrote:
> "WQ" <wq [at] email.com> wrote in message
> news:1145301532.435585.61990 [at] e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > I really fear a dumbed-down take on a
> > "faithful" version [faithful in spirit if not to the written word] of
> > CR. Here's a chance for EON to do it right and it looks like they're
> > just going to be slipping back into their old ways again. That's, of
> > course, if that synopsis is true.
>
> The synopsis was dead-on. That is how Vesper has been scripted to die. What
> Mr.Wahlman's excellent summary just barely touches upon is that Bond could
> save Vesper, but she refuses it. How well that will be articulated on the
> screen by Campbell remains to be seen. I think there's room for confusion
> among audience members if it's not done correctly, but the bottom line is
> that yes, indeed, that is the script, that is how Purvis and Wade have her
> dying. And by the way, it is Purvis and Wade's scene. Think about it. Bond
> has to save Christmas Jones from drowning in the submarine in TWINE. In DAD
> Bond saves Jinx from drowning in the melting Ice Palace. And now we have
> Bond trying to save Vesper from drowning...and presumeably will be
> unsuccessful. See a trend there? Purvis and Wade have some sort of fixation
> on drowning women.

--- Thanks for that extra insight. And, well, it's quite disappointing
if that's what it's going to be. A very poor way to see her die. EON
has clearly chosen to dilute the whole suicide scene by turning it into
a typical Hollywood I-tried-to-save-the-girl-but-she-wouldn't-let-me
malarky. This will simply kill the impact of the suicide on Bond.
Sure, he's going to feel bad about losing his grip on her, but he would
feel worse and angrier if she had killed herself out of his sight and
without his knowledge. That's where a sense of being robbed of
something [love] and someone [Vesper] would be made more apparent. But
his losing his grip on her, well, that's more like, gee, at least I had
a chance to save her and there was still time to say goodbye and get
one more look out of her as she plummeted into the ocean. Bond needs
to ROBBED of Vesper and not watch her go bye-bye for the imapct of the
suicide to work on him in the way it's supposed to. But as I've said
all along, Purvis and Wade are perhaps the worst and most unimaginative
scribes of the Bond series and I had no allusions that CR would be the
film that EON wants to believe itself and everyone else to be.
Additionally, this isn't going to make Craig come off looking good as
Bond without that impact because I think that of all the scenes in the
movie, that's the most crucial one, the one where he'll have to prove
himself as his kind of Bond, in much the same way as Lazenby did in his
final moments while cradling a dead Tracy.

> I had no allusions that EON would be faithful to Fleming's novel, so this
> came as no surprise. I wouldn't even be surprised if EON films alternate
> scenes for Vesper's death and Bond's torture scene and uses those on the
> dvd, instead choosing to give the theatrical release a more upbeat, happy
> ending. Not saying it's going to happen, but something to be mindful of.

--- Well, it still doesn't make me feel better. But then, if they do
include alternate, and more credible, versions on the DVD, one can
always re-edit them with the right software into the way the film
should be. Hey, looks like another job for Blofeld's Cat coming up.

>
> -------------------------------------
> Icebreaker
> "You don't fool me, Ricky. I know all about your kind. Your new student eyes
> immediately graze over the firm young flanks of our females, and I won't
> have it. Capiche, amigo? There's nothing i'd like better than to put you new
> students back on a boat to where you came from."
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254511 ] Sa, 22 April 2006 23:46
Icebreaker  
"WQ" <wq [at] email.com> wrote in message
news:1145724329.106367.272980 [at] z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...

> --- Thanks for that extra insight. And, well, it's quite disappointing
> if that's what it's going to be. A very poor way to see her die. EON
> has clearly chosen to dilute the whole suicide scene by turning it into
> a typical Hollywood I-tried-to-save-the-girl-but-she-wouldn't-let-me
> malarky. This will simply kill the impact of the suicide on Bond.
> Sure, he's going to feel bad about losing his grip on her, but he would
> feel worse and angrier if she had killed herself out of his sight and
> without his knowledge. That's where a sense of being robbed of
> something [love] and someone [Vesper] would be made more apparent. But
> his losing his grip on her, well, that's more like, gee, at least I had
> a chance to save her and there was still time to say goodbye and get
> one more look out of her as she plummeted into the ocean. Bond needs
> to ROBBED of Vesper and not watch her go bye-bye for the imapct of the
> suicide to work on him in the way it's supposed to. But as I've said
> all along, Purvis and Wade are perhaps the worst and most unimaginative
> scribes of the Bond series and I had no allusions that CR would be the
> film that EON wants to believe itself and everyone else to be.
> Additionally, this isn't going to make Craig come off looking good as
> Bond without that impact because I think that of all the scenes in the
> movie, that's the most crucial one, the one where he'll have to prove
> himself as his kind of Bond, in much the same way as Lazenby did in his
> final moments while cradling a dead Tracy.

The movie was always going to be a tough sell no matter who the actor
playing Bond was, but at least with Brosnan in the role the audience
would've had some of the emotional investment in him to at least have tried
to go where the movie wanted to take us. I don't think that Craig is
particularly well-served by this script, as the relationship and dialogue
between Vesper and Bond is average at best. The script is closer in tone to
TWINE, where you have fewer action pieces and longer, more drawn out
character scenes. That would work for me as TWINE did, unfortuately, Craig
is no Brosnan, and Green is no Marceau, and Mikkelsen is no Carlyle.

-------------------------------------
Icebreaker
"You don't fool me, Ricky. I know all about your kind. Your new student eyes
immediately graze over the firm young flanks of our females, and I won't
have it. Capiche, amigo? There's nothing i'd like better than to put you new
students back on a boat to where you came from."
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254512 ] So, 23 April 2006 00:00
JHause  
Icebreaker wrote:
> That would work for me as TWINE did, unfortuately, Craig
> is no Brosnan, and Green is no Marceau, and Mikkelsen is no Carlyle.
>

THANK THE FRIGGIN' LORD!!!
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #254515 ] So, 23 April 2006 04:49
MikeSo  
"JHause" <JHause [at] aol.com> wrote in message
news:1145743209.594424.122230 [at] z34g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> Icebreaker wrote:
>> That would work for me as TWINE did, unfortuately, Craig
>> is no Brosnan, and Green is no Marceau, and Mikkelsen is no Carlyle.
>>
>
> THANK THE FRIGGIN' LORD!!!
>

Is it Brosnan, Marceau or Carlyle that bothers you so?

Or is it all three?

--

Thanks,
Mike
Re: Ultimate Script Spoilers posted at AJB [message #256749 ] Mo, 24 April 2006 01:39
JHause  
MikeSo wrote:
> Is it Brosnan, Marceau or Carlyle that bothers you so?
>
> Or is it all three?
>

All three. None of them as bad as Denise Richards, but by about the
50th shocked soap-opera take I was ready for a nap. Maybe it was the
director's fault, but nobody gave a 3-dimensional performance. One
emotion per scene, no subtext. No development.
Vorheriges Thema:Ultimate Editions - July in UK
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