| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #242484] |
Mi, 29 März 2006 01:40 |
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"Matthew Woodcraft" <mattheww [at] chiark.greenend.org.uk> skrev i en meddelelse
news:skb*O8Lcr [at] news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...
> Derek Broughton <news [at] pointerstop.ca> wrote:
> > I recall the line that went something
> > like "and, of course, no spider has ever liked being called Attercop" (a
> > linguistic joke I still don't understand, though "cop" is related to the
> > Welsh for spider).
> "Attercop" is a Northern English dialect word for a spider.
Very probably related to Scand "edderkopp", which is our word for
"spider" and which literally means "poison-cup".
Hrafn.
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| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #242490 ] |
Mi, 29 März 2006 03:25 |
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Raven wrote:
> "Matthew Woodcraft" <mattheww [at] chiark.greenend.org.uk> skrev i en
> meddelelse news:skb*O8Lcr [at] news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...
>
>> Derek Broughton <news [at] pointerstop.ca> wrote:
>
>> > I recall the line that went something
>> > like "and, of course, no spider has ever liked being called Attercop"
>> > (a linguistic joke I still don't understand, though "cop" is related to
>> > the Welsh for spider).
>
>> "Attercop" is a Northern English dialect word for a spider.
Thanks. Which Northern English dialect? My parents are from the northeast
(Hartlepool) and I was a child in Cumberland, and I didn't learn that one.
I'm still not much clearer on just why this would annoy the spiders!
> Very probably related to Scand "edderkopp", which is our word for
> "spider" and which literally means "poison-cup".
Neat - and also, I presume, related to the snake: "adder". I suppose I
wouldn't want to be called "poison cup" either.
--
derek
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| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #244148 ] |
Mi, 29 März 2006 21:30 |
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Derek Broughton <news [at] pointerstop.ca> wrote:
>Thanks. Which Northern English dialect? My parents are from the northeast
>(Hartlepool) and I was a child in Cumberland, and I didn't learn that one.
I would have said Yorkshire, but a little Googling suggests that it's
rather more widespread than that.
-M-
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| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #244175 ] |
Do, 30 März 2006 13:42 |
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"Raven" <jonlennart.beck.god [at] damn.get2net.that.dk.spam> wrote in
news:WbkWf.164$DO7.42 [at] news.get2net.dk:
> "Matthew Woodcraft" <mattheww [at] chiark.greenend.org.uk> skrev i en
> meddelelse news:skb*O8Lcr [at] news.chiark.greenend.org.uk...
>
>> Derek Broughton <news [at] pointerstop.ca> wrote:
>
>> > I recall the line that went something
>> > like "and, of course, no spider has ever liked being called
>> > Attercop" (a linguistic joke I still don't understand, though "cop"
>> > is related to the Welsh for spider).
>
>> "Attercop" is a Northern English dialect word for a spider.
>
> Very probably related to Scand "edderkopp", which is our word for
> "spider" and which literally means "poison-cup".
Danish edderkopp and English cobweb looks related too?
--
Mästerkatten
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| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #244197 ] |
Fr, 31 März 2006 00:10 |
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In message <news:Xns97968B7934D1C19283305 [at] 130.133.1.4>
"Mästerkatten" <nopspam [at] nospam.com> enriched us with:
>
<snip>
> Danish edderkopp and English cobweb looks related too?
The 'kop', 'kopp', 'cob', 'cop' (and probably other similar) is an old
word for spider (I'm sure somebody can explain where it comes from).
The 'edder' in the Danish word is 'poison' (so basically we're calling
all spiders 'poison-spider', which is of course true enough, but it
gets a bit foolish when we get to 'poisonous poison-spider' <G>).
Hazarding a guess, I imagine that the 'atter' part in the 'attercop'
has the same original meaning.
--
Troels Forchhammer
Valid e-mail is <t.forch(a)email.dk>
The truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head.
- /Hogfather/ (Terry Pratchett)
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| Re: the fox in FOTR [message #244205 ] |
Fr, 31 März 2006 14:39 |
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Troels Forchhammer wrote:
but it
> gets a bit foolish when we get to 'poisonous poison-spider' <G>).
>
The point is all well and good. But in English, at least, there's a fair
degree of redundancy. Some of this is in common phraseology so old that
some portions of the redundancy have faded away leaving a rather
puzzling puzzle for the linquistically inquisitive.
Pete H
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