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Science Fiction » alt.fan.starwars » Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS
Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175725] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 04:11
Todd  
Having rewatched some of my favorite scenes from RotS, I was struck by
how bad certain lightsaber scenes were. Nick Gilliard is supposed to
be the master, and he certainly has done some great work, but how does
he justify the following:

1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.

2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.
In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it. One shot
even has him just jabbing forward with his saber like a pansy.

3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175726 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 04:23
dullard  
"Todd" <twrexxnospam [at] earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:fqpso1d9h94ijntus69ik6n30t9009g3cp [at] 4ax.com...
> Having rewatched some of my favorite scenes from RotS, I was struck by
> how bad certain lightsaber scenes were. Nick Gilliard is supposed to
> be the master, and he certainly has done some great work, but how does
> he justify the following:

Not all of the lightsaber fights are meant to have the same intensity as the
Aniken/Obi-Wan duel. If they were all that intense then the final duel
wouldn't have the same impact. I'm sure that they held back a lot with the
sword fight at the end of AOTC on purpose because they were considering the
final battle of ROTS.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175738 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 05:53
No1ButU  
> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.

Dude.. The guy who plays the Emperor is like.. OLD. Why do you think the
lightsaber duel in ANH between Obiwan and Vader was so poor? Because he
could barely MOVE, that's why.. They're lucky to have gotten as much action
out of this fight as they did considering his age, and if they took him out
and used a stunt double the whole time it would have been cheesy and it
would have showed.

> 2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.
> In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
> saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
> fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it. One shot
> even has him just jabbing forward with his saber like a pansy.

Well, this could easily be because he was letting Mace have the upper hand
until Anakin arrived... Please, don't reply with the whole "Was he letting
Mace win argument", we've heard it a thousand times-- I'm just saying that
if he had open season on Mace and didn't take a shot, this is a reasonable
explanation.

> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.

That part was awesome! It had nothing to do with showmanship, it was a
deliberate move on Lucas' part to show how Anakin's training by Obi-wan had
made them clones of one another in their fighting style- they were mirroring
one another's actions so precisely that they neither could move in for a
strike, and when they finally did, it resulted in stalemate, to which Obiwan
reverts to a force-push (and Anakin the same, having been trained by
Obi-wan), and they wind up pushing one another away.. Very, VERY cool scene.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175741 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 07:46
Todd  
On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 23:53:00 -0500, "No1ButU" <no1butu [at] sympatico.ca>
wrote:

>Dude.. The guy who plays the Emperor is like.. OLD. Why do you think the
>lightsaber duel in ANH between Obiwan and Vader was so poor? Because he
>could barely MOVE, that's why.. They're lucky to have gotten as much action
>out of this fight as they did considering his age, and if they took him out
>and used a stunt double the whole time it would have been cheesy and it
>would have showed.
>

That would make sense if they had not introduced the character of
Dooku, who kicked Obi Wan's AND Anakin's ass in Ep. 2. Age is too
easy of an explanation. Plus, the guy just got done spinning through
the air to attack all four masters. That dog won't hunt.

>That part was awesome! It had nothing to do with showmanship, it was a
>deliberate move on Lucas' part to show how Anakin's training by Obi-wan had
>made them clones of one another in their fighting style- they were mirroring
>one another's actions so precisely that they neither could move in for a
>strike, and when they finally did, it resulted in stalemate, to which Obiwan
>reverts to a force-push (and Anakin the same, having been trained by
>Obi-wan), and they wind up pushing one another away.. Very, VERY cool scene.
>

I just thought it was a waste of energy. It looked ridiculous to me.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175754 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 12:45
SpammersDie  
"No1ButU" <no1butu [at] sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:Ahvjf.6661$wf2.644508 [at] news20.bellglobal.com...
>> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
>> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
>> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
>> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
>> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
>> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
>> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
>> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
>> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.
>
> Dude.. The guy who plays the Emperor is like.. OLD. Why do you think the
> lightsaber duel in ANH between Obiwan and Vader was so poor? Because he
> could barely MOVE, that's why.. They're lucky to have gotten as much
> action out of this fight as they did considering his age, and if they took
> him out and used a stunt double the whole time it would have been cheesy
> and it would have showed.

Dude... they *did* use a fencing double. McDiarmid's head was digitally
inserted on top of the double. Same with Christopher Lee in his duels.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175755 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 13:14
Spork  
"No1ButU" <no1butu [at] sympatico.ca> wrote in message
news:Ahvjf.6661$wf2.644508 [at] news20.bellglobal.com...

>
> That part was awesome! It had nothing to do with showmanship, it was a
> deliberate move on Lucas' part to show how Anakin's training by Obi-wan
had
> made them clones of one another in their fighting style- they were
mirroring
> one another's actions so precisely that they neither could move in for a
> strike, and when they finally did, it resulted in stalemate, to which
Obiwan
> reverts to a force-push (and Anakin the same, having been trained by
> Obi-wan), and they wind up pushing one another away.. Very, VERY cool
scene.
>
>

I had a different take on the force push there. Consider this: Obi was
force pushed by Maul into a pit. He was force pushed by Dooku and then
thrown around like a rag doll. I bet he could see the force push from
Anakin coming and thought, "I'm not falling for that again." You can see
from the progressive duels in the prequels that Obi does in fact learn from
his past mistakes / experiences.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175756 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 18:22
frenchy  
I agree with it being very cool, ok they weren't hitting each other,
but it's only for about 2 measley seconds, geez. It's not like they
started out doing that and starting flipping them in the air like
cheerleader batons. Just a quick little cool bravado moment that
breaks up the otherwise constant sword-bashing. I LOVED it and it was
something new to boot. Actually it's one of my favorite bits from the
whole last fight scene, very unexpected.
Also love the moment where they show Anakin sort of stomping 2 or 3
steps towards Obi with his sword down, towards the camera... then boom
he starts to take another swing at him with a grimace. LIke, "oh man,
I am gonna GET you!!"
As for Palpy killing off the the 3 Jedis too quickly, I figure they
knew the movie was loaded with GOOD Anakin/Obi mostly non-double and
non-digital-head dueling already, and who needs to see more digital
Palpy heads stuck on a double anyway. The point was to get him and
Mace going at it, not to have another drawn out duel with 3 jedis I
didn't even know or give a hoot about, just swat them and get to Mace.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175758 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 18:40
Todd  
On Thu, 01 Dec 2005 11:45:52 GMT, "SpammersDie" <xx [at] xx.xx> wrote:

>
>"No1ButU" <no1butu [at] sympatico.ca> wrote in message
>news:Ahvjf.6661$wf2.644508 [at] news20.bellglobal.com...
>>> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
>>> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
>>> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
>>> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
>>> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
>>> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
>>> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
>>> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
>>> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.
>>
>> Dude.. The guy who plays the Emperor is like.. OLD. Why do you think the
>> lightsaber duel in ANH between Obiwan and Vader was so poor? Because he
>> could barely MOVE, that's why.. They're lucky to have gotten as much
>> action out of this fight as they did considering his age, and if they took
>> him out and used a stunt double the whole time it would have been cheesy
>> and it would have showed.
>
>Dude... they *did* use a fencing double. McDiarmid's head was digitally
>inserted on top of the double. Same with Christopher Lee in his duels.
>
>

He's 61. Hardly old.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175759 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 18:54
frenchy  
<<Dude... they *did* use a fencing double. McDiarmid's head was
digitally
inserted on top of the double.>>

Which is why I said we didn't need more of it, the parts where the
digital head were overlayed were pretty obvious and didn't really match
well in intensity with the real McDiarmid's rather amateurish-looking
saber-wielding shots. Still enjoyed it though. He's an old guy, if
they wanted to do long drawn out battle with him they'd have to use a
lot more use of a double or digi-head and then it would have stuck out
even more as being 'fake' compared to long, mostly 'real' Obi/Ani
fight. When he fights Yoda they got away with it since it's just some
guy in a head-to-toe robe with a ton of evil makeup.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175761 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 20:22
Ryan Case  
> As for Palpy killing off the the 3 Jedis too quickly, I figure they
> knew the movie was loaded with GOOD Anakin/Obi mostly non-double and
> non-digital-head dueling already, and who needs to see more digital
> Palpy heads stuck on a double anyway. The point was to get him and
> Mace going at it, not to have another drawn out duel with 3 jedis I
> didn't even know or give a hoot about, just swat them and get to Mace.
>


I agree with not wanting to water down the final duel, but I could have
definately done with at least 10 seconds worth of something to make the
jedi that went with Mace look at least awake and not like white belt
first day students.

Something more akin to a Steven Seagal scene like in Above the Law in
the mini mart or something like that. That could have lead quite nicely
into him with Mace, the other Jedi could have just gotten to Palpy first
too, that would have worked better. As was, with the close up shots of
Palpy killing the other three the way they were filmed it almost looks
like an editing fix later for a scene that was forgot to be shot.

I would have much rather had this and a duel between Mace and Palp that
was half as long with Mace getting obviously wooped until Anakin shows
up. Show the old bastard really pulling the puppet strings.

Of course I would have rather had good dialogs written in the script too.

Ryan
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175762 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 21:22
frenchy  
<< I agree with not wanting to water down the final duel, but I could
have
definately done with at least 10 seconds worth of something to make the

jedi that went with Mace look at least awake and not like white belt
first day students. >>>

I might go along with this if the 10 seconds was something really
really REALLY unusual that is totally unexpected, not the usual
dueling. Have Palpy pull some weird tricks out of his hat. I dunno...
make him be able to just have his sword float right out of his hand, it
starts spinning like a propellor, homes right in on the first Jedi and
slices him up like a roll of baloney, or spins at him vertically and
slices him in half from head to toe. Then he tries it on Mace but he
is able deflect it and Palpy then re-grabs the saber. Then go from
there : ) I.e. something weird like Grievous doing the propellor
thing while stomping towards Obi, that was certainly brand new.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175778 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 03:39
Todd  
On 1 Dec 2005 12:22:44 -0800, "frenchy" <mf101723 [at] msn.com> wrote:

><< I agree with not wanting to water down the final duel, but I could
>have
>definately done with at least 10 seconds worth of something to make the
>
>jedi that went with Mace look at least awake and not like white belt
>first day students. >>>
>
>I might go along with this if the 10 seconds was something really
>really REALLY unusual that is totally unexpected, not the usual
>dueling. Have Palpy pull some weird tricks out of his hat. I dunno...
>make him be able to just have his sword float right out of his hand, it
>starts spinning like a propellor, homes right in on the first Jedi and
>slices him up like a roll of baloney, or spins at him vertically and
>slices him in half from head to toe. Then he tries it on Mace but he
>is able deflect it and Palpy then re-grabs the saber. Then go from
>there : ) I.e. something weird like Grievous doing the propellor
>thing while stomping towards Obi, that was certainly brand new.


The Grievous thing with the lightsabers was just plain lame. He
wasn't using them so much as having them spin like a circular saw.
There's no art to that. Any mechanical device could have done the
same thing. He showed no variation in his moves at all.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175787 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 06:03
frenchy  
<<The Grievous thing with the lightsabers was just plain lame. He
wasn't using them so much as having them spin like a circular saw. >>

I don't care, it still looked cool. It's a movie, sometimes it's
enough for something to just look cool, it doesn't always have to make
perfect sense or fit into the art of fighting. So he wasn't using
them, big deal, he was just doing it to show off... or to scare the guy
by looking menacing... or just having a little fun before he does away
with him, bad guys in movies do that all the time. All three of those
scenarios is perfectly plausible.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #175794 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 07:46
Ryan Robbins  
"Todd" <twrexxnospam [at] earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:fqpso1d9h94ijntus69ik6n30t9009g3cp [at] 4ax.com...
> 2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.

Palpatine wanted Anakin to think that Mace had the upperhand.

> In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
> saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
> fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it.

Palpatine is a master manipulator. Killing Mace quickly would not have been
effective in getting Anakin to the Dark Side.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #178161 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 21:41
seanocity  
Todd wrote:
> Having rewatched some of my favorite scenes from RotS, I was struck by
> how bad certain lightsaber scenes were. Nick Gilliard is supposed to
> be the master, and he certainly has done some great work, but how does
> he justify the following:
>
> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.

Maybe he was using the Dark Side to cloud their abilities?

> 2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.
> In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
> saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
> fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it. One shot
> even has him just jabbing forward with his saber like a pansy.

Um, Palpy needed Mace to be in control by the time Anakin got there, so
further his "Jedi are taking over!" paranoia in Anakin's mind.

> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.

You're not just noticing the lightsaber/dick thing, are you? ;p

--
Sean
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #178166 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 22:35
frenchy  
That's why Obi picks up Ani's saber, he took it home to measure it
8 /
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #178209 ] Sa, 03 Dezember 2005 15:24
seanocity  
frenchy wrote:
> That's why Obi picks up Ani's saber, he took it home to measure it

I always noticed a sense of.......jealousy (?) when Obi-Wan took that
lightsaber out in ANH and gave it to Luke.

--
Sean
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #178244 ] So, 04 Dezember 2005 01:37
Brett McConnie  
"Sean Walsh: Piettus Worshipus" <seanocity [at] gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1133619849.843817.44450 [at] g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> > That's why Obi picks up Ani's saber, he took it home to measure it
>
> I always noticed a sense of.......jealousy (?) when Obi-Wan took that
> lightsaber out in ANH and gave it to Luke.

"This is your father's lightsabre. Some people thought it was much bigger
than mine but they didn't understand that size doesn't matter."
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180293 ] Mo, 05 Dezember 2005 18:51
D  
"Todd" <twrexxnospam [at] earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:fqpso1d9h94ijntus69ik6n30t9009g3cp [at] 4ax.com...
> Having rewatched some of my favorite scenes from RotS, I was struck by
> how bad certain lightsaber scenes were. Nick Gilliard is supposed to
> be the master, and he certainly has done some great work, but how does
> he justify the following:
>
> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.
>
> 2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.
> In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
> saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
> fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it. One shot
> even has him just jabbing forward with his saber like a pansy.
>
> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.
>
> Todd

It's because Nick Gillard isn't a swords man, he's a stunt man. Within the
stunt industry it was considered a shock that they chose him to do the
fights. The Phantom Menace duel was ok because it was choreographed by Ray
Parks with Nick not really having that much input. I know this from being on
the inside of the films, but I'll leave it as that.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180295 ] Mo, 05 Dezember 2005 19:02
B-Hate-Me  
"D" <QD [at] wurldnetwork.plus.com> wrote in message
news:43947df8$0$82640$ed2619ec [at] ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
>> There was a real ballet quality
>> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
>> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
>> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.

"ballet"? "Kid Fisto"?......

.....Sounds as if you were looking for some gay kiddie porn.

>> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
>> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
>> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
>> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.

See above.........
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180303 ] Di, 06 Dezember 2005 05:53
Todd  
On Mon, 5 Dec 2005 17:51:02 -0000, "D" <QD [at] wurldnetwork.plus.com>
wrote:

>
>"Todd" <twrexxnospam [at] earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:fqpso1d9h94ijntus69ik6n30t9009g3cp [at] 4ax.com...
>> Having rewatched some of my favorite scenes from RotS, I was struck by
>> how bad certain lightsaber scenes were. Nick Gilliard is supposed to
>> be the master, and he certainly has done some great work, but how does
>> he justify the following:
>>
>> 1. Palpatine taking out three masters without breaking a sweat. At
>> least one of them was wide open with no defensive posture. I just
>> wish there had been a longer scene with all four masters battling
>> Sidious. One of the few things I loved about TPM (very few things to
>> love about that movie) was the long shot of Qui-Gon and Obi Wan
>> battling Darth Maul at the same time. There was a real ballet quality
>> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
>> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
>> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.
>>
>> 2. Palpatine NOT going for the kill with Mace when he had the chance.
>> In one scene he has his saber pointed right at Mace's chest and Mace's
>> saber is over his head! Palpatine doesn't strike me as one who would
>> fight honorably. He'd take the kill shot when he had it. One shot
>> even has him just jabbing forward with his saber like a pansy.
>>
>> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
>> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
>> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
>> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.
>>
>> Todd
>
>It's because Nick Gillard isn't a swords man, he's a stunt man. Within the
>stunt industry it was considered a shock that they chose him to do the
>fights. The Phantom Menace duel was ok because it was choreographed by Ray
>Parks with Nick not really having that much input. I know this from being on
>the inside of the films, but I'll leave it as that.
>


Interesting. I remember seeing a documentary where Nick was painted
as the savior of the swordplay. This paints a very different picture.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180304 ] Di, 06 Dezember 2005 05:55
Todd  
On Mon, 5 Dec 2005 13:02:34 -0500, "B-Hate-Me" <BHateMe [at] home> wrote:

>
>"D" <QD [at] wurldnetwork.plus.com> wrote in message
>news:43947df8$0$82640$ed2619ec [at] ptn-nntp-reader03.plus.net...
>>> There was a real ballet quality
>>> to it. I would have much preferred to see Sidious and the masters
>>> back out into the large hall and have the fight last longer. I just
>>> think guys like Kit Fisto deserved better.
>
>"ballet"? "Kid Fisto"?......
>
>....Sounds as if you were looking for some gay kiddie porn.
>
>>> 3. Anakin vs. Obi Wan. Clearly the best duel of the series but I
>>> can't help but laugh when, in one scene, they are standing in front of
>>> each other windmilling their sabers over their heads without striking.
>>> It's the Jedi equivalent of a dick measuring contest.
>
>See above.........
>
>

I'm sure you have some very interesting Rorschach tests. Please leave
me out of your sick fantasies.

Todd
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180366 ] So, 11 Dezember 2005 15:47
jjbinks  
The worst part of the whole movie is when Palpatine cuts down the 3
Jedi. They didn't even bother to hide the stuntman's face.

Palpatine couldn't kill Mace. Whatever happened in that duel it had to
appear as though Mace was about to murder him when Anakin arrived.
Anakin already made the decision to keep him alive now he needed to
take action against the Jedi in order to turn to the dark side. Anakin
wanted Palpatine to be in jail. Some fans think Mace actually beat Sids
but it was all just a setup for Anakin.

Too many closeups, not enough dialogue. I find it hard to believe that
Obi and Anakin would just hack away at each other silently. The
twirling sabre routine was laughable. This was on a tv special and
Lucas said they needed this shot to transition between opposite camera
angles. Whatever, it didn't show up that way in the final film.

The Dooku duel was awesome but too short.

The only good part of Sids vs. Yoda was before the duel even started.

Why is it that the Jedi ALWAYS ignite their sabres first? Knowledge and
defense my arse.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #180370 ] So, 11 Dezember 2005 20:49
frenchy  
<< I find it hard to believe that
Obi and Anakin would just hack away at each other silently.>>

They are trying to kill each other, not do Shakespeare. They had a
little verbal sparring in there though. If they'd talked more, then
somebody would be in here saying gee are they ever going to shut up?
The twirling was cool looking to me, it was very short and quick cut
right between the vicious dueling.

<<The Dooku duel was awesome but too short. >>

Compared to the Obi/Anakin battle, it was nothing that special to me,
except the the lines delivered from Dooku (all great) and him throwing
the two of them against the wall, and of course his hands and head
being diced off. Knowing it's a digital face on their so much
tarnishes it a bit. The setting, the mood and the dialogue made this
battle for me.
Re: Bad Lightsaber Choreography in RotS [message #195425 ] Do, 05 Januar 2006 13:49
charlie12345  
Some of you are too cynical. Palpatine does have Mace cornered and
doesn't pull the trigger, but looking at the scene again, isn't it
because if palpatine darts forward, mace could fly backwards and regain
his posture. Palpatine just waiting for Anakin to rescue him so he
could turn him to the dark side doesn't wash with me. What if Anakin
got stuck in traffic on his way there, mace would have been slicing and
dicing. Mace also present a good argument for slaying palpatine, others
on this news group suggest that mace has turned evil himself, but that
isn't the case either.
The dooku duel had quality all over it, it certainly should have been
longer.
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