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Science Fiction » alt.fan.starwars » Stupid questions from a starwars novice...
Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175703] Mi, 30 November 2005 23:04
Shhhh  
Hello all,

As the topic suggests I'm a novice when it comes to these movies; I consider
myself a fan who wants to get a little deeper... By no means am I a die hard
(perhaps someday) anyway I have some questions if you folks would be kind
enough to address them...

1.) In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible that the chancellor/emperor
was able to take out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving him a fight? That
just doesn't make sense to me... these Jedi had their sabers up, but were
simply no match.

2.) I went to the bookstore looking for a book on starwars, and must
admit... was shocked that there were so many... seemed like a whole walls
worth. Yet if memory serves none of the books were written by George Lucas,
but rather by other people? How am I supposed to know which books are
"official star wars books" i.e. sequel/prequel to the existing movies, and
which are just BS written by anybodys.

3.) Along those same lines, is there a website or a listing anywhere that
lists ALL the starwars books in order, so they could be read as one
incredibly long continuous story?

4.) And finally you folks seem to know the names of many of the Jedi, in
these movies I don't recall them ever being mentioned (how did you come up
with the names?)

Thank you all so very much,
Shhhh
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175705 ] Mi, 30 November 2005 23:13
jjj_soper  
Shhhh wrote:
> 2.) I went to the bookstore looking for a book on starwars, and must
> admit... was shocked that there were so many... seemed like a whole walls
> worth. Yet if memory serves none of the books were written by George Lucas,
> but rather by other people? How am I supposed to know which books are
> "official star wars books" i.e. sequel/prequel to the existing movies, and
> which are just BS written by anybodys.
>
All the novels are authorized but some are much better than others.
I'd say start with stuff by Zahn and Crispin, maybe Luceno for prequel
trilogy stuff (he's dry, but good at tying things together). Amazon
reviews are good for deciding what to read after that.

> 3.) Along those same lines, is there a website or a listing anywhere that
> lists ALL the starwars books in order, so they could be read as one
> incredibly long continuous story?
For just novels, the paperback edition of Labyrinth of Evil had one.
Amazon has some lists also with the book reviews.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175706 ] Mi, 30 November 2005 23:16
Notifier Deamon  
Post removed (X-No-Archive: yes)
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175707 ] Mi, 30 November 2005 23:54
fish  
Shhhh sez...

> 1.) In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible
> that the chancellor/emperor was able to take
> out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving him a
> fight?

The DVD does include an Audio Commentary where they detail the movie as you
watch it. I haven't actually started watching it with the Commentary mode
yet, but I will very soon.

To answer your question more specifically, my personal belief (being a
Palpatine fan myself) is that Palpatine was sitting there waiting for the
Jedi to arrive. He basically is THAT good.

Now, keep in mind that if Palpatine were to have killed off Mace that quick,
then Anakin might not have a reason to turn to the dark side - because there
would be no immediate danger.

It is my belief that Palpatine was playing, holding back until Anakin's
arrival.

It seems to me that Palpatine was making fun of Mace. Those faces made me
clap! I was laughing and having a good time watching Palpatine go wild. Then
he tossed his own light saber out the window just in time for Anakin's
arrival.

Perfect timing or coincidence?

Perhaps that will be answered in the commentary, but for now, I will say
that I believe that Palpatine is the master of manipulation!

By the way, you have a very interesting name there, Shhhh!

May the force be with you!

--
______________
=====fish=====
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175711 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 00:47
Anybody  
In article <438e24d2$0$38649$742ec2ed [at] news.sonic.net>, Sadok
<no-spam [at] sonic.net> wrote:

> Quoth Shhhh:
> : 4.) And finally you folks seem to know the names of many of the Jedi, in
> : these movies I don't recall them ever being mentioned (how did you come up
> : with the names?)
>
> Many of them (Jedi) have been issued as action figures, but you might want
> to check out http://www.starwars.com/databank for more fannish wealth than
> even you can imagine. ;-)

George Lucas names all his movie characters, even if the name isn't
actually ever said on-screen. Other characters come from the books,
comics and games and are named by the people creating those.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175712 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 00:51
atomic  
> To answer your question more specifically, my personal belief (being a
> Palpatine fan myself) is that Palpatine was sitting there waiting for the
> Jedi to arrive. He basically is THAT good.

I agree he is THAT skilled or powerful.

> Now, keep in mind that if Palpatine were to have killed off Mace that quick,
> then Anakin might not have a reason to turn to the dark side - because there
> would be no immediate danger.

I think the whole saga would have been much more interesting if
Palpatine was killed, and the Emperor was in fact Plageous who actually
didn't die, or maybe came back to life through his unique force
abilities. There could be a whole other story about Vader seeking out
Plageous to learn this power in the hope he could maybe bring Padme
back.

I know many people would hate this scenario, and prefer that Vader was
just a bad seed.

> It is my belief that Palpatine was playing, holding back until Anakin's
> arrival.

I think so too.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175713 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 00:51
Anybody  
In article <1133388826.547647.118070 [at] g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
jjj_soper [at] hotmail.com wrote:

> Shhhh wrote:
> > 2.) I went to the bookstore looking for a book on starwars, and must
> > admit... was shocked that there were so many... seemed like a whole walls
> > worth. Yet if memory serves none of the books were written by George Lucas,
> > but rather by other people? How am I supposed to know which books are
> > "official star wars books" i.e. sequel/prequel to the existing movies, and
> > which are just BS written by anybodys.
>
> All the novels are authorized but some are much better than others.
> I'd say start with stuff by Zahn and Crispin, maybe Luceno for prequel
> trilogy stuff (he's dry, but good at tying things together). Amazon
> reviews are good for deciding what to read after that.
>
> > 3.) Along those same lines, is there a website or a listing anywhere that
> > lists ALL the starwars books in order, so they could be read as one
> > incredibly long continuous story?
>
> For just novels, the paperback edition of Labyrinth of Evil had one.
> Amazon has some lists also with the book reviews.

There's a timeline in the front of all the paperback novels that lists
the books and movies in order, although some of the newer ones only
cover the Clone Wars timeframe.

All the books (adult novels and kids' storybooks) and the comics fit
into the timeline somewhere, and are officially licensed by LucasFilm,
so all are technically prequels / sequels / in-betweens to the movies.

None of the books are written by George Lucas (including the original
"Star Wars" / Episode IV novel that has his name on it), but the movie
novels are based on his screenplays, although not everything in the
novel appears in the movies due to late changes while making the movie.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175714 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 01:12
frenchy  
> To answer your question more specifically, my personal belief (being a
> Palpatine fan myself) is that Palpatine was sitting there waiting for the
> Jedi to arrive. He basically is THAT good.

I agree he is THAT skilled or powerful. >>>>

I think it's just that the movie just had him sort of walk up to them
and "stick 'em" pretty quickly without showing any prowess in how he
killed such skilled dudes so easily. They probably didn't need a drawn
out fight at that point in the movie so oh well, let's just have him
kill them off quick so he can get to dueling Mace. And they had them
show up with Mace so it didn't look like he was just there by himself
to carry out some lone vendetta.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175728 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 04:33
Anybody  
In article <1133395963.580539.171810 [at] z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
"frenchy" <mf101723 [at] msn.com> wrote:

> > To answer your question more specifically, my personal belief (being a
> > Palpatine fan myself) is that Palpatine was sitting there waiting for the
> > Jedi to arrive. He basically is THAT good.
>
> I agree he is THAT skilled or powerful. >>>>
>
> I think it's just that the movie just had him sort of walk up to them
> and "stick 'em" pretty quickly without showing any prowess in how he
> killed such skilled dudes so easily. They probably didn't need a drawn
> out fight at that point in the movie so oh well, let's just have him
> kill them off quick so he can get to dueling Mace. And they had them
> show up with Mace so it didn't look like he was just there by himself
> to carry out some lone vendetta.

Mace's companions were surprised by Palpatine - both his skill and his
quick change from mild-mannered politician to Sith Lord.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175733 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 05:07
atomic  
> Mace's companions were surprised by Palpatine - both his skill and his
> quick change from mild-mannered politician to Sith Lord.

For sure - I think they definately assumed less of Palpatine than Mace
did.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175734 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 05:21
SpammersDie  
"Shhhh" <123 [at] 456.com> wrote in message
news:E-ydnRvERtCXvxPenZ2dnUVZ_tidnZ2d [at] comcast.com...
> Hello all,
>
> As the topic suggests I'm a novice when it comes to these movies; I
> consider myself a fan who wants to get a little deeper... By no means am I
> a die hard (perhaps someday) anyway I have some questions if you folks
> would be kind enough to address them...
>
> 1.) In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible that the
> chancellor/emperor was able to take out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving
> him a fight? That just doesn't make sense to me... these Jedi had their
> sabers up, but were simply no match.

They made the same mistake you're making: underestimating Palp. For decades,
they've known him as a doddering, overdressed politician. And the Jedi were
all ready to head to the temple and whoopie because of the news that
Generous Grievous has finally got his butt kicked once and for all but now
Mace tells them they have to go arrest the Chancellor because the village
idiot Anakin said Palp is a Sith.

Oooookay, Annie, sure... Palpy is a Sith.

Deep inside, none of them really believed until it was too late that Palp
could successfully wield a butter knife let alone a lightsaber.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175737 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 05:40
mexican_equivalent  
Shhhh wrote:
>
> 1.) In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible that the chancellor/emperor
> was able to take out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving him a fight? That
> just doesn't make sense to me... these Jedi had their sabers up, but were
> simply no match.
>

Here is the real answer to that question:

Revenge of the Sith has already waaay too many Jedi duels in it.
Probably more than the first four movies combined. In 2 hours, you had
Dooku vs Anakin, then Grievous vs Obiwan, then Mace vs Sidious, then
Sidious vs Yoda, and then finally Anakin vs Obiwan.

George Lucas correctly felt that with each succeeding lightsabre duel
within a single movie, the duels become less and less exciting. How
unfortunate would it be for RotS to feature four looong sabre duels,
and by the time you get to Anakin vs Obiwan you've gotten numb to it
all? Afterall, Anakin vs Obiwan is supposed to be THE sabre duel of
the entire saga.

So George Lucas's script greatly trimmed down all the duels leading up
to Anakin vs Obiwan. That's the reason why Sidious slices down those
two Jedis so quickly. George didn't want to devote too much time to
duels preceeding Anakin vs Obiwan, ESPECIALLY when it involves the two
faceless jedis that went up against Sidious.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175750 ] Do, 01 Dezember 2005 12:09
Jack  
>>In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible that the chancellor/emperor
was able to take out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving him a fight? That
just doesn't make sense to me... these Jedi had their sabers up, but were
simply no match.

With everything going on such as the Clone War, trying to find out who was
behind all that, the shock of finding out that Chancellor Palpatine is
actually a Sith, and all that, the Jedi could’ve been confused and wondering
about everything. This could’ve given Palpatine an advantage. And he moved
fast to attack the Jedi, so the speed and surprise added to his advantage.
The Jedi were taken by surprise. It could be that Mace recovered from his
surprise and also told himself to worry about the Clone War and all the
other problems later. So Mace was ready in time to fight back. Palpatine
killed the other 3 before they had a chance to recover from their shock.

Also, Mace must be a little more well trained than the other three. They all
were Jedi Masters but Mace could’ve been a master longer than the others.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175780 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 04:18
Anybody  
In article <dmmll6$o1h$1 [at] nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>, "Jack"
<starfleet-fan [at] talk21.com> wrote:

> Also, Mace must be a little more well trained than the other three. They all
> were Jedi Masters but Mace could’ve been a master longer than the others.

I vaguely recall someone saying they weren't Jedi Masters at all
(except Mace Windu of course), but I've never bothered to check that.
It is possible that since almost all of the high-ranking Jedi would be
out in the field commanding clone troops that Mace Windu had to take
along lesser Jedi.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175792 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 07:11
Shhhh  
Thank you all for your responses... you've given me lots to think about...
I'll have to check out the Amazon site, for more info on the books...

If you all don't mind I've thought of another question...

In the beginning battle, when the chancellor tells Anakin to kill Dooku...
Dooku shoots the chancelor a look of disbelief... is this because he know
the chanecllor was the Sith and was shocked at the back stab... or was he
just shocked the a politician would order a jedi to commit such an act?

thank you all so much,
Shhhh


"Shhhh" <123 [at] 456.com> wrote in message
news:E-ydnRvERtCXvxPenZ2dnUVZ_tidnZ2d [at] comcast.com...
> Hello all,
>
> As the topic suggests I'm a novice when it comes to these movies; I
> consider myself a fan who wants to get a little deeper... By no means am I
> a die hard (perhaps someday) anyway I have some questions if you folks
> would be kind enough to address them...
>
> 1.) In Revenge of the Sith... how is it possible that the
> chancellor/emperor was able to take out 3 Jedi before Mace started giving
> him a fight? That just doesn't make sense to me... these Jedi had their
> sabers up, but were simply no match.
>
> 2.) I went to the bookstore looking for a book on starwars, and must
> admit... was shocked that there were so many... seemed like a whole walls
> worth. Yet if memory serves none of the books were written by George
> Lucas, but rather by other people? How am I supposed to know which books
> are "official star wars books" i.e. sequel/prequel to the existing movies,
> and which are just BS written by anybodys.
>
> 3.) Along those same lines, is there a website or a listing anywhere that
> lists ALL the starwars books in order, so they could be read as one
> incredibly long continuous story?
>
> 4.) And finally you folks seem to know the names of many of the Jedi, in
> these movies I don't recall them ever being mentioned (how did you come up
> with the names?)
>
> Thank you all so very much,
> Shhhh
>
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #175793 ] Fr, 02 Dezember 2005 07:27
Anybody  
In article <maydnVEUUesfeBLeRVn-uQ [at] comcast.com>, "Shhhh" <123 [at] 456.com>
wrote:

> If you all don't mind I've thought of another question...
>
> In the beginning battle, when the chancellor tells Anakin to kill Dooku...
> Dooku shoots the chancelor a look of disbelief... is this because he know
> the chanecllor was the Sith and was shocked at the back stab... or was he
> just shocked the a politician would order a jedi to commit such an act?

Dooku knows Palpatine is also Darth Sidious and was surprised at
suddenly becoming dispensible (which proves he didn't study the Dark
Side very well). Count Dooku is Sidious' Sith Apprentice and also use a
second name: Darth Tyrannus.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #178229 ] Sa, 03 Dezember 2005 23:38
Jack  
>>>>Also, Mace must be a little more well trained than the other three. They
all were Jedi Masters but Mace could've been a master longer than the
others.

>>I vaguely recall someone saying they weren't Jedi Masters at all (except
Mace Windu of course), but I've never bothered to check that. It is possible
that since almost all of the high-ranking Jedi would be out in the field
commanding clone troops that Mace Windu had to take
along lesser Jedi.

I would have assume they all were Jedi Masters based on the popular theory
that Jedi Masters have green lightsabre while the Jedi Padiwans have blue
lightsabres. Maybe Mace is a Jedi Master with longer experience and is on
the council while the others *are* Jedi Masters but with shorter experience
(as if they just passed their test a few years ago) and are not experience
enough to be on the council.

But whether or not they are Masters or not, I still think that they were all
too surprised and shocked to find out the truth therefore allowing Palpatine
to kill all, but thankfully Mace recovered form his shock in time to fight
back.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #178241 ] So, 04 Dezember 2005 01:27
Brett McConnie  
"Jack" <starfleet-fan [at] talk21.com> wrote in message
news:dmt6pa$f60$2 [at] nwrdmz03.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
> I would have assume they all were Jedi Masters based on the popular theory
> that Jedi Masters have green lightsabre while the Jedi Padiwans have blue
> lightsabres.

I don't know if that theory really is popular but it has no credence and no
basis in he movies. Good guys have green and blue, bad guys have red and
Mace Windu has purple. The colour of a Jedi's lightsabre is totally random
and has no meaning.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #178243 ] So, 04 Dezember 2005 01:34
SpammersDie  
> I would have assume they all were Jedi Masters based on the popular theory
> that Jedi Masters have green lightsabre while the Jedi Padiwans have blue
> lightsabres.

Then Obi-Wan should have had a greenie in ROTS. Even Anakin was no longer a
Padawan by then (where do Knights fit into this scheme?) And Obi-Wan should
have seriously slapped Luke down hard in ROTJ for his presumptiousness.

And those were some seriously young Jedi Masters being tutored by Yoda in
AOTC!



>But whether or not they are Masters or not, I still think that they were
>all
>too surprised and shocked to find out the truth therefore allowing
>Palpatine
>to kill all, but thankfully Mace recovered form his shock in time to fight
>back

They'd become arrogant and complacent so they figured Palps would be a
pushover.

Hell, most of *us* pictured him as a manipulator rather than a fighter for
the last 20 years.
Re: Stupid questions from a starwars novice... [message #178249 ] So, 04 Dezember 2005 03:14
Anybody  
In article <dmt6pa$f60$2 [at] nwrdmz03.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>, "Jack"
<starfleet-fan [at] talk21.com> wrote:

> >>>Also, Mace must be a little more well trained than the other three. They
> >>>all were Jedi Masters but Mace could've been a master longer than the
> >>>others.
> >>
> >>I vaguely recall someone saying they weren't Jedi Masters at all (except
> >>Mace Windu of course), but I've never bothered to check that. It is
> >>possible that since almost all of the high-ranking Jedi would be out in
> >>the field commanding clone troops that Mace Windu had to take along
> >>lesser Jedi.
>
> I would have assume they all were Jedi Masters based on the popular theory
> that Jedi Masters have green lightsabre while the Jedi Padiwans have blue
> lightsabres.

Jedi chose the colour crystal they want to use, it has nothing to do
with their ranking - Mace Windu choose purple purposely to be different
because the purple crystals are rare.



> Maybe Mace is a Jedi Master with longer experience and is on
> the council while the others *are* Jedi Masters but with shorter experience
> (as if they just passed their test a few years ago) and are not experience
> enough to be on the council.

Being on the Jedi Council isn't a permanent position (the only
exception is Yoda) and doesn't really have much to do with experience
as such - Ki Adi Mundi is on the Council in the movies and wasn't even
a Jedi Master, just a Jedi Knight (which kind of blows Anakin's temper
tantrum about not being made a Master out of the water).
Vorheriges Thema:The Emperor's true look
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