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Fantasy » alt.fan.tolkien » Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew
Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #110494] Mo, 15 August 2005 12:04
onq  
URL: http://www.madcowprod.com
------------------------------------------------------------



“Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI’s timeline
was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
2000?”

The importance of this week’s revelation that an Army intelligence unit
was tracking Mohamed Atta’s movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
it yet...

You’ve been hearing it for three years in articles in the
MadCowMorningNews, and in “Welcome to TerrorLand.”

Now you can hear it from an elite Army intelligence unit, one which
obviously has several patriots with very large cojones. Their testimony
is clear and explicit and only one conclusion can be drawn from it...

The FBI has been telling a massive lie to the 9.11 Commission and the
American people, a lie whose result has been to halt in its tracks, as a
Commission spokesman freely admitted on Thursday, the investigation into
the murder of almost 3000 people

People go to jail for that sort of thing, don’t they?

God willing, we may be about to find out.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #110503 ] Mo, 15 August 2005 22:58
Huan the hound  
On 2005-08-15, Michael O'Neill <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in <43006890.202479AC [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie>:
[snipped it ALL without reading it]

Why are you posting this to RABT?

--
Huan, the hound of Valinor
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113497 ] Mi, 17 August 2005 04:43
Flame of the West  
Michael O'Neill wrote:

> “Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI’s timeline
> was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
> were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
> 2000?”

The Democrats on the bipartisan panel insisted that this
information not be included in the report, in order to
cover up for the Clinton adminstration, which set the
table for 9/11 by doing nothing to inform the FBI of
what our military intelligence had discovered.

> The importance of this week’s revelation that an Army intelligence unit
> was tracking Mohamed Atta’s movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
> so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
> it yet...

What, that Democrats covered up for Clinton? They've
been doing that for years.


-- FotW

Reality is for those who cannot cope with Middle-earth.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113509 ] Mi, 17 August 2005 08:20
Morgil  
Flame of the West wrote:
> Michael O'Neill wrote:
>
>> “Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI’s timeline
>> was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
>> were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
>> 2000?”
>
>
> The Democrats on the bipartisan panel insisted that this
> information not be included in the report, in order to
> cover up for the Clinton adminstration, which set the
> table for 9/11 by doing nothing to inform the FBI of
> what our military intelligence had discovered.

And Republicans allowed this to happen because they are such
nice guys who wouldn't want to do anything that might upset
or embarass the Clinton administration? Likely story...

Morgil
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113515 ] Mi, 17 August 2005 16:57
Pippen  
"Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message
news:43006890.202479AC [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie...
> URL: http://www.madcowprod.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> "Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI's timeline
> was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
> were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
> 2000?"
>
> The importance of this week's revelation that an Army intelligence unit
> was tracking Mohamed Atta's movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
> so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
> it yet...
>
> You've been hearing it for three years in articles in the
> MadCowMorningNews, and in "Welcome to TerrorLand."
>
> Now you can hear it from an elite Army intelligence unit, one which
> obviously has several patriots with very large cojones. Their testimony
> is clear and explicit and only one conclusion can be drawn from it...
>
> The FBI has been telling a massive lie to the 9.11 Commission and the
> American people, a lie whose result has been to halt in its tracks, as a
> Commission spokesman freely admitted on Thursday, the investigation into
> the murder of almost 3000 people
>
> People go to jail for that sort of thing, don't they?
>
> God willing, we may be about to find out.

Michael,

You knowledge of Tolkien is remarkable but your take on US motivation and
action is a little twisted. Let me make some assumptions:
1. You live in Ireland
2. You are Irish
Given this I would assume you have enough problems in your own country to
last you a life time... So while you are sitting in your glass house writing
drivel about the US take a moment and look around, you might find some
conspiracies right in your own backyard.

-p
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113522 ] Mi, 17 August 2005 22:45
Ty  
"Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message

> "Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI's timeline
> was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
> were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
> 2000?"

> The importance of this week's revelation that an Army intelligence unit
> was tracking Mohamed Atta's movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
> so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
> it yet...

> You've been hearing it for three years in articles in the
> MadCowMorningNews, and in "Welcome to TerrorLand."

> Now you can hear it from an elite Army intelligence unit, one which
> obviously has several patriots with very large cojones. Their testimony
> is clear and explicit and only one conclusion can be drawn from it...

> The FBI has been telling a massive lie to the 9.11 Commission and the
> American people, a lie whose result has been to halt in its tracks, as a
> Commission spokesman freely admitted on Thursday, the investigation into
> the murder of almost 3000 people

> People go to jail for that sort of thing, don't they?

Well, unless they're Bill Clinton.

> God willing, we may be about to find out.

I wouldn't get too excited just yet. While I generally welcome every
additional fact that illustrates the utter ineptitude of the Clinton
Administration, I'm not prepared to agree *yet* that this consitutes yet
more evidence of gross negligence by Clinton's PC-obsessed administration.
The reason is that we do not yet know the context of the warning. (And I
believe it was a secret US military team that discovered Atta's intentions,
but was *prohibited* from telling the FBI due to the absurd rules
promulgated by the clueless Ms. Jamie Gorelik -- a Democrat-selected member
of the 9-11 Commission, by the way.)

If Atta's name was one of, say, thousands of names (most of whom did not
carry out terrorist attacks), then such a "warning" isn't worth the paper
it's printed on. Kinda like that idiot Richard Clarke's purported
"warning"..."uh, it seems likely that Al Queda may try to attack targets
that, uh, may be, uh somewhere in the US, at uh, some point in the
future..." Brilliant analysis, Dick..

OTOH, if there was a specific and detailed warning that Atta posed a clear
and present danger to the US, then the buffoonish Clinton Administration's
obsession with political correctness may have contributed to the murder of
thousands of Americans.

My guess is that the warning was pretty vague. Of course, it should have
been noted in the report of the 9-11 Commission and I think that the
Commission needs to explain why they failed to mention it.

I am also curious as to why the Clinton Administration apparently failed to
heed numerous detailed warnings, including a rather specific State
Department warning in 1996 about Bin Laden's intentions. And of course, the
detailed memorandum by prosecutor Mary Jo White arguing (correctly) that
Gorelik's idiotic ban on intelligence sharing was severely hindering efforts
to interdict terrorists.

--Ty
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113524 ] Mi, 17 August 2005 23:13
Flame of the West  
Morgil wrote:

> And Republicans allowed this to happen because they are such
> nice guys who wouldn't want to do anything that might upset
> or embarass the Clinton administration? Likely story...

A likelier story is that the Republicans also deep-sixed
some information that was embarrassing to their side.
It was after all a bipartisan panel, that is, restricted
to loyal Republicans and Democrats. There were no
gadflies from outside the two-party cabal.


-- FotW

Reality is for those who cannot cope with Middle-earth.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113565 ] Fr, 19 August 2005 12:47
onq  
Pippen wrote:
>
> "Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message
> news:43006890.202479AC [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie...
> > URL: http://www.madcowprod.com
> > ------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> > "Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI's timeline
> > was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
> > were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
> > 2000?"
> >
> > The importance of this week's revelation that an Army intelligence unit
> > was tracking Mohamed Atta's movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
> > so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
> > it yet...
> >
> > You've been hearing it for three years in articles in the
> > MadCowMorningNews, and in "Welcome to TerrorLand."
> >
> > Now you can hear it from an elite Army intelligence unit, one which
> > obviously has several patriots with very large cojones. Their testimony
> > is clear and explicit and only one conclusion can be drawn from it...
> >
> > The FBI has been telling a massive lie to the 9.11 Commission and the
> > American people, a lie whose result has been to halt in its tracks, as a
> > Commission spokesman freely admitted on Thursday, the investigation into
> > the murder of almost 3000 people
> >
> > People go to jail for that sort of thing, don't they?
> >
> > God willing, we may be about to find out.
>
> Michael,
>
> You knowledge of Tolkien is remarkable but your take on US motivation and
> action is a little twisted. Let me make some assumptions:
> 1. You live in Ireland
> 2. You are Irish
> Given this I would assume you have enough problems in your own country to
> last you a life time... So while you are sitting in your glass house writing
> drivel about the US take a moment and look around, you might find some
> conspiracies right in your own backyard.
>
> -p

Many thanks for your concerned post.

Now that the deluge of financial support for proscribed terrorist
organizations has dwindled to a trickle from the United States, we seem
to be getting a handle on it.

let me make a couple of assumptions.

1. You live in America.
2. You are an American.

Given that your country goes out of its way to support foreign dictators,
invades countries without just cause, ferments civil unrest, promotes
torture and economic slavery as part of its foreign policy an dgenerally
behaves as it it owns not just the western hemisphere, but the entire
globe, I expect you will have made enough enemies to last you a lifetime.
So while you are sitting contemplating your élite deviant ascendancy,
"take a moment and look around, you might find some conspiracies right in
your own backyard".

I already know about the ones in mine, including the planned increased
role for the CIA in law enforcement and generating stife with the Muslim
population here in Ireland.

No surprises.

M.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113566 ] Fr, 19 August 2005 13:04
onq  
Ty wrote:
>
> "Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message
>
> > "Upon what basis did the 9.11 Commission conclude that the FBI's timeline
> > was correct and that an elite Army Intel unit was mistaken in saying they
> > were tracking Mohamed Atta roaming freely across America during 1999 and
> > 2000?"
>
> > The importance of this week's revelation that an Army intelligence unit
> > was tracking Mohamed Atta's movements in the U.S. during 1999 and 2000 is
> > so mind-bogglingly massive that it seems that nobody seems to quite get
> > it yet...
>
> > You've been hearing it for three years in articles in the
> > MadCowMorningNews, and in "Welcome to TerrorLand."
>
> > Now you can hear it from an elite Army intelligence unit, one which
> > obviously has several patriots with very large cojones. Their testimony
> > is clear and explicit and only one conclusion can be drawn from it...
>
> > The FBI has been telling a massive lie to the 9.11 Commission and the
> > American people, a lie whose result has been to halt in its tracks, as a
> > Commission spokesman freely admitted on Thursday, the investigation into
> > the murder of almost 3000 people
>
> > People go to jail for that sort of thing, don't they?
>
> Well, unless they're Bill Clinton.
>
> > God willing, we may be about to find out.
>
> I wouldn't get too excited just yet. While I generally welcome every
> additional fact that illustrates the utter ineptitude of the Clinton
> Administration, I'm not prepared to agree *yet* that this consitutes yet
> more evidence of gross negligence by Clinton's PC-obsessed administration.
> The reason is that we do not yet know the context of the warning. (And I
> believe it was a secret US military team that discovered Atta's intentions,
> but was *prohibited* from telling the FBI due to the absurd rules
> promulgated by the clueless Ms. Jamie Gorelik -- a Democrat-selected member
> of the 9-11 Commission, by the way.)
>
> If Atta's name was one of, say, thousands of names (most of whom did not
> carry out terrorist attacks), then such a "warning" isn't worth the paper
> it's printed on. Kinda like that idiot Richard Clarke's purported
> "warning"..."uh, it seems likely that Al Queda may try to attack targets
> that, uh, may be, uh somewhere in the US, at uh, some point in the
> future..." Brilliant analysis, Dick..
>
> OTOH, if there was a specific and detailed warning that Atta posed a clear
> and present danger to the US, then the buffoonish Clinton Administration's
> obsession with political correctness may have contributed to the murder of
> thousands of Americans.
>
> My guess is that the warning was pretty vague. Of course, it should have
> been noted in the report of the 9-11 Commission and I think that the
> Commission needs to explain why they failed to mention it.
>
> I am also curious as to why the Clinton Administration apparently failed to
> heed numerous detailed warnings, including a rather specific State
> Department warning in 1996 about Bin Laden's intentions. And of course, the
> detailed memorandum by prosecutor Mary Jo White arguing (correctly) that
> Gorelik's idiotic ban on intelligence sharing was severely hindering efforts
> to interdict terrorists.
>
> --Ty

============================================

Mohammed Atta shares a name with a previous Bus-Bomber. He is on the
Interpol wanted list. That should have raised a flag in every law
enforcement agency in the states when he tried to gain entry.

You are taking the view that Atta actually *was* a terrorist, when every
indication is that he was a "protected agent" - part of a homegrown plot
to manipulate the American electorate by staging an "unprovoked attack".


There are at least three precedents in fact.

The alleged attack on the cruiser Maine.

The alleged Ptomkin Incident.

The "surprise" attack on Pearl Harbour.


There are several others, for example the lack of support from the air
force for the troops dropped during the Bay of Pigs incident which led
their ignominious defeat and thence to Kennedy's assassination.


There is also the planned Operation Northwoods which exists in documented
form but which was never carried out at that time under that name.


As for the ban on sharing information, I'm sure you're familiar with the
term "plausible deniability". That, as well as the war games scenario
played out on 9-11 depicting just such an attack resulting in the
standing down of the Norad security system can only be seen as a
co-ordinated washing of hands by officialdom.

I, for one, am not convinced.

But then, I don't live in a country whose élite deviant form of
governance considers its electorate nothing more than cannon fodder to be
used to inflame passions to further their murderous, aggressive stance
towards the third world and the middle east.

M.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113578 ] Do, 18 August 2005 20:12
John Jones  
"Pippen" <not [at] valid.mail> wrote in message
news:57idnYJV_s7LzZ7eRVn-1A [at] comcast.com...
>
> "Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message
> news:43006890.202479AC [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie...
> > God willing, we may be about to find out.
>
> Michael,
>
> You knowledge of Tolkien is remarkable but your take on US motivation and
> action is a little twisted. Let me make some assumptions:
> 1. You live in Ireland
> 2. You are Irish

Deduction: you are stupid.
Pippen: please don't feed the troll.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113582 ] Sa, 20 August 2005 00:43
Ty  
"Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message

> Mohammed Atta shares a name with a previous Bus-Bomber. He is on the
> Interpol wanted list. That should have raised a flag in every law
> enforcement agency in the states when he tried to gain entry.
>
> You are taking the view that Atta actually *was* a terrorist, when every
> indication is that he was a "protected agent" - part of a homegrown plot
> to manipulate the American electorate by staging an "unprovoked attack".

Well, you've departed controlled flight. Let us know if you recover.

--Ty
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113584 ] Sa, 20 August 2005 07:44
Pippen  
"John Jones" <john [at] jones5011.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:de58fn$2dg$1 [at] newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk...
> "Pippen" <not [at] valid.mail> wrote in message
> news:57idnYJV_s7LzZ7eRVn-1A [at] comcast.com...
>>
>> "Michael O'Neill" <onq [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie> wrote in message
>> news:43006890.202479AC [at] bwahahaha.indigo.ie...
>> > God willing, we may be about to find out.
>>
>> Michael,
>>
>> You knowledge of Tolkien is remarkable but your take on US motivation and
>> action is a little twisted. Let me make some assumptions:
>> 1. You live in Ireland
>> 2. You are Irish
>
> Deduction: you are stupid.
> Pippen: please don't feed the troll.
>
>

I know better, I hit the send button in the heat of the moment...

-p
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113592 ] So, 21 August 2005 06:19
Flame of the West  
Michael O'Neill wrote:

> You are taking the view that Atta actually *was* a terrorist, when every
> indication is that he was a "protected agent" - part of a homegrown plot
> to manipulate the American electorate by staging an "unprovoked attack".

Every indication on your favorite tin-foil-hat websites.
Virtually nobody this side of the loonie-bin believes
that the U.S. government staged 9/11.

I can see why you tend to post hints and questions and
avoid making assertions. Your assertions are so pre-
posterous that they discredit everything else you say.


-- FotW

Reality is for those who cannot cope with Middle-earth.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113608 ] So, 21 August 2005 17:38
Morgil  
Flame of the West wrote:
> Michael O'Neill wrote:
>
>> You are taking the view that Atta actually *was* a terrorist, when every
>> indication is that he was a "protected agent" - part of a homegrown plot
>> to manipulate the American electorate by staging an "unprovoked attack".
>
>
> Every indication on your favorite tin-foil-hat websites.
> Virtually nobody this side of the loonie-bin believes
> that the U.S. government staged 9/11.

The loonie-bin has two sides?

> I can see why you tend to post hints and questions and
> avoid making assertions. Your assertions are so pre-
> posterous that they discredit everything else you say.

Do you think it's okay to discredit everything someone says
on grounds that some of their assertions are prepostrous?

Morgil
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113612 ] So, 21 August 2005 20:29
Flame of the West  
Morgil wrote:

> Do you think it's okay to discredit everything someone says
> on grounds that some of their assertions are prepostrous?

No, even he is sometimes right, e.g. on English
guilt in Ireland.


-- FotW

Reality is for those who cannot cope with Middle-earth.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113615 ] So, 21 August 2005 22:14
Yuk Tang  
Flame of the West <FotW [at] NOSPAMsolinas.org> wrote in
news:iKKdnTx5lbiAVZXeRVn-1Q [at] comcast.com:
> Morgil wrote:
>
>> Do you think it's okay to discredit everything someone says
>> on grounds that some of their assertions are prepostrous?
>
> No, even he is sometimes right, e.g. on English
> guilt in Ireland.

Still going on about that old canard? What *did* the English do
during the famine, and what could they have done differently,
considering the mores of the time?

Things happen in farming, some years there are good harvests, some
years bad, and monoculture allied to big families and small plots
make for an extremely risky existence. In Hong Kong's case it was a
prolonged rainy season when we were supposed to be sowing, in
Ireland's it was a Europe-wide fungus. In our case a local merchant
imported emergency supplies of food to tide us through, in Ireland's
the local landlords exploited the situation to drive the poor off
their land. In neither case did the colonial masters intervene
overmuch. But we don't blame the Japanese for this event (still
within living memory), while you continue to vilify the English (why
not the Scots?) for something that happened a century and a half ago.
Why?


--
Cheers, ymt.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113624 ] So, 21 August 2005 23:36
Raven  
"Morgil" <morestelx [at] hotmail.com> skrev i en meddelelse
news:dea75l$mtq$1 [at] nyytiset.pp.htv.fi...

> The loonie-bin has two sides?

The Republicans and the Democrats?

Korppi.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #113625 ] Mo, 22 August 2005 00:12
Morgil  
Raven wrote:
> "Morgil" <morestelx [at] hotmail.com> skrev i en meddelelse
> news:dea75l$mtq$1 [at] nyytiset.pp.htv.fi...
>
>
>>The loonie-bin has two sides?
>
>
> The Republicans and the Democrats?

Shame on your anti-Amercanism! I was talking about
the Great Atlantic Loonie-Bin ;)

Morgil
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #118097 ] Mi, 24 August 2005 21:06
Jette Goldie  
"Flame of the West" <FotW [at] NOSPAMsolinas.org> wrote in message
news:iKKdnTx5lbiAVZXeRVn-1Q [at] comcast.com...
> Morgil wrote:
>
> > Do you think it's okay to discredit everything someone says
> > on grounds that some of their assertions are prepostrous?
>
> No, even he is sometimes right, e.g. on English
> guilt in Ireland.


You say that because his point of view matches
*yours*.

But there are other points of view, even on that
situation.


--
Jette Goldie
jette [at] blueyonder.co.uk
Some people are like Slinkies . . . not really good for anything, but
you
still can't help but smile when you see one tumble down the stairs.
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #118098 ] Mi, 24 August 2005 21:29
Morgil  
Jette Goldie wrote:
> "Flame of the West" <FotW [at] NOSPAMsolinas.org> wrote in message
> news:iKKdnTx5lbiAVZXeRVn-1Q [at] comcast.com...

>>No, even he is sometimes right, e.g. on English
>>guilt in Ireland.
>
>
>
> You say that because his point of view matches
> *yours*.
>
> But there are other points of view, even on that
> situation.

So did you have fun on William Wallace Anniversary Day? ;)

Morgil
Re: Lies and the FBI AKA the CLean Up Crew [message #118118 ] Do, 25 August 2005 02:17
Jette Goldie  
"Morgil" <morestelx [at] hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:deihrm$n33$1 [at] nyytiset.pp.htv.fi...
> Jette Goldie wrote:
> > "Flame of the West" <FotW [at] NOSPAMsolinas.org> wrote in message
> > news:iKKdnTx5lbiAVZXeRVn-1Q [at] comcast.com...
>
> >>No, even he is sometimes right, e.g. on English
> >>guilt in Ireland.
> >
> >
> >
> > You say that because his point of view matches
> > *yours*.
> >
> > But there are other points of view, even on that
> > situation.
>
> So did you have fun on William Wallace Anniversary Day? ;)


Didn't even notice it, like about 90% of the rest of Scotland.

However I had a lovely Jette Goldie natal anniversary
day today instead.


--
Jette Goldie
jette [at] blueyonder.co.uk
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving
safely
in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather... to skid in
sideways,
thoroughly used, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming...
"Daaaaaamn... what a trip!"
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